Welcome!

**OfFDeepz** · November 6, 2018, 02:33 PM

Just wanted to post and say thank you for all the contributors and knowledge here. Just got my KBQ a week ago and wanted to give my general feedback. My first cook was a whole chicken cut up and I used the Simon and Garfunkel rub. Cranked it all the way and had to back it off a little to hold 325 degrees. Cooked faster than I anticipated and when i checked the temp it was about 175-180 degrees. I couldn't believe it but it was way juicy and turned out awesome. The skin had some nice crisp to it and the flavor was great. Next, I did baby back ribs with rub from Oklahoma Joes in KC and painted on some Sweet Baby Rays. They were pretty good, but i definitely need to make some changes. Here are my problems and I hope they help other newbs

1. Keep the lid off while you are waiting for the lump to fully ignite the logs. With the lid on it seems to take longer to get it going. I also found that using different sizes of wood really helped to give it space to breathe.

2. I used a water pan with the ribs and spritzed them every hour. I felt like they were overly juicy for ribs. Is that crazy? Had a really nice bark and looked pretty. Also, I followed some advice on here to not overdue the rub. I found out my personal preference is to have a lot of rub so I'll add a lot more for the next cook. I still plan to use the water pan on the brisket this weekend since Bill seems to rock those Briskets.

3. I found the smoke flavor perfect on the chicken and light on the ribs. I read above that Ed says to leave the top poppet open and the bottom closed for the full "dirty"smoke. I mixed it up in the rib cook of, top closed, bottom open and both open. I used hickory wood for both smokes.

4. Another mistake I made was not realizing how sensitive the temperature control knob is. I was moving it between the numbers and it seemed to constantly go. I finally realized after being a big dum-dum that you only need to move it a tiny bit.

Excited to take my notes and retry the ribs and can't wait to do the brisket this weekend. Again, thank you to all the contributors here. Next time, I'll post some pics

**OfFDeepz** · November 6, 2018, 07:15 PM

EdF Thank you, i'm enjoying it and will shell out for the membership. Ricardo I also used the lump to start it. I'm thinking about dumping half the coals, putting some wood and a few coals to wedge it and see if that lights it better. That is half the fun, figuring all of this out!

**BBQ_Bill** · November 6, 2018, 08:55 PM

Welcome to The Pit OfFDeepz!
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Lump is suggested by Bill Karau versus Charcoal due to regular Charcoal producing excess ash that fills the area below the coal tray too quickly.
Bill K. stated that charcoal consists of a very large amount of limestone, which does not burn and this limestone fills the ash container in the bottom of the firebox very quickly.
However...
I shovel in what's left of my searing coals, add lots thinner Mesquite splits, (Try an X pattern) then turn the thermostat up to full throttle.
In time, the fire box is roaring and building a good coal bed, so I add even heavier wood and drop the temperature setting of the thermostat.
Next, I insert a thermometer in the port right there by the fans and work on getting my average to 230°F.
Generally, only slight tweaks of the thermostat are needed from that point on to keep the average temperature at 230°F.
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After the temperature settles in, I turn it off with a switch to add or "fluff" wood in the firebox.

Was gonna put a 12" extension cord on the KBQ with this model with the red switch as shown above because they do not sit flush due to the "rain top" on the KBQ controller, however... the GE switch shown with the white switch may fit and work well.
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UPDATE
A switch has always been the best way to go for me to stop the draw fan when adding wood or when clearing the holes in the grate when temperatures start dropping due to plugging up and restricting air flow to the cook box.
However, the design on these with a red switch as shown above leaves me wanting better, like maybe the one with the white switch?

1) I was wanting a switch to plug right into the prongs on the KBQ, but this one with the red switch won't do it.

2) In the continual switching off and on of this red switch model, during a cook, it can become slightly disconnected and the smoker can lose power.
(NOT good)
Plus, I really don't want to tie knots in the cords to hold this model switch in place.

I wanted these ones to work well, but the white switch model made by GE might just be the ticket.
We will see.

**OfFDeepz** · November 6, 2018, 11:54 PM

BBQ_Bill Thanks for the welcome. That switch is so smart. I was bumping the knob and it's hard to get it exactly dialed back in. Mind sharing where i can get this and what it's called? Also, I'm getting some more wood tomorrow and will get some different sized splits to try the x pattern. Thanks!

**BBQ_Bill** · November 7, 2018, 07:09 AM

OfFDeepz
I bought a Kindling Cracker and LUV it for making "skinny" Mesquite splits.
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Bought a 3-pack of those switches but have since bought 3 others that may work better. (Hoping)
The more recent purchase is not here yet but I will post here after they arrive and I get a chance to try them out.

**BBQ_Bill** · November 7, 2018, 10:44 PM

Good point Histrix
With the door open, there would be no draw through the firebox.

**BBQ_Bill** · November 8, 2018, 09:51 PM

Timcee Rfuilrez

The stainless steel "Quick Pins" arrived today. (For holding the door on)
I tried them and they seem to work so far.
There is a bit of "play" in them, but the door opens and closes and latches correctly.

I have 4 Packer Briskets and a load of Chicken Breasts to smoke for a 11 a.m. Saturday sale.
These will get a "workout" so I will post an UPDATE afterwards and let you guys know what I think of them when all is "said and done."
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I paid $4.58 for two with "free" shipping so the price was good.
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UPDATE
They performed with no problems during this cook, however as mentioned, there is play in them, but the door opened and closed without incident.
They come out nicely with a tug to overcome the spring loaded ball.
I am satisfied so far.
Time will tell if the heat deteriorates the spring tension on the ball.
Went ahead and bought 4 more for the other two KBQ's.

**BBQ_Bill** · November 10, 2018, 07:57 PM

The General Electric switches arrived today.
They do not have a light that indicates whether they are on or off, but they fit the KBQ Controller snugly, sliding UNDER the "Rain Lip" nicely as shown.

UPDATE:
Yeah, I am done with this "switch" thing.
My hope's are that these hold up and last.
Time will tell.
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GE 25511 Grounded Power Switch

**BBQ_Bill** · November 11, 2018, 07:42 AM

Yes lostclusters
Consider a fellow starting his maiden voyage into a public venture such as catering BBQ or supplying cooked meats to a growing number of stationary break trucks...
(Like the ones sitting in city parking lots)
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It sort of makes more sense to buy more C60 units than to buy one Friedrich KBQ-400 or an Oyler smoker when cooking for customers in a production type situation.
There are few disadvantages with many advantages.
Like...
Cooking different meats at different temperatures, all at the same time.
And timing or staging the starts of those cooks so they can meet schedules.
Also, cooking with different woods like apple wood for pork while cooking with Oak for beef ribs.
Plus using more KBQ C-60 smokers, or less according to demand.
A sudden catering order of good size with several different meats required would be a "tall order" with only one large smoker, right?
There are many other benefits to single units versus one big smoker like slowly increasing your cooking power as your customer base and finances grow.
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The big one for someone slowly starting up a business is price...
1 each KBQ-400 @ $23,000 versus 8 each KBQ C-60 units @ around $12,000.
Both will cook the same volume of meat.
To me, it all makes good sense to a backyard BBQ person cooking occasionally for family, that is slowly moving into a growing customer situation.
That is BBQ Bill in a nutshell my friend.
================================================== =====================
UPDATE:
12 Nov 2020
I have come to the conclusion that 8 KBQ C-60 units would be almost impossible for one person to handle at one time (with ease) during each and every cook when wanting the consistency I MUST have.
This is in regards to a restaurants heavy production needs.
(24 packers for the next days customers)
Case in point...
I went away to grab some burgers and got hung up for about an hour and a half.
My pitmaster had a problem and was seriously struggling without me there.
(I WISH he had called, but he didn't and tried to handle it on his own)
When I returned, he was freaked and trying like crazy to fix the problems.
Once I returned, I too struggled like crazy to get it all sorted out and back on track.
The end product suffered a bit due to cook time lost without enough "cushion."
So...
From that one bad experience, I can say that running only 4 KBQ C-60's at the same time are truly a struggle even for an experienced user if and when certain problems arise.
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Basically, with a large number of KBQ C-60's for great smoke and a large number of MasterBuilts for great finishing, a new pitmaster working for me might just call me at 2 AM and say he is quitting and walking out in the middle of a large quantity brisket cook, which would be a real drag to say the least!
So...
I've decided I NOW need a KBQ-400 or equivalent to handle the large load of packer briskets with only one fire to manage, and will use the smaller volume C-60's for the shorter cooks like ribs and sausage, etc. which can go right into holding when done.
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Bottom Line:
Clear understanding plus life's real BBQ problems can become really obvious when you find yourself in the middle of the "fire" when making good decisions under stress.
BBQ Bill

**BBQ_Bill** · November 11, 2018, 09:27 AM

Problems keeping your KBQ temperature at max?
KBQ has advised me that to operate at maximum temperature, the holes in the coal grate in the firebox MUST be covered with a good layer of hot coals.
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For a chicken cook, several reputable sources recommend a high temperature cook to give a crispy outside and a moist inside to that yard bird.
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If your coal grate has "rat holes" as Bill K. calls them, you will not develop the high temperatures you need for chicken.
If you can see open holes in your coal grate, you need to tamp the top of the wood to move hot coals down and cover those open holes.
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Yes, the inverted flames as they are drawn downward by the draft fan look really cool going thru those holes, right?
The problem is, without the hot glowing coals covering those holes, the cold air from the openings in the sides is actually being sucked in.
So while watching those cool flames, your flame "show" IS cooling things down below!
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The bottom line for all of us KBQ folks to remember is...
Hot coals are like a heating blanket, and that thick hot bed of coals will "trump" simple yellow flames that look cool going down "Rat Holes" in your grate.
THAT scenario equals a COLDER KBQ.
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Bill K. also shared another sweet "morsel" of KBQ knowledge...
When it comes to heating your KBQ's cook box and HOLDING it at good temperatures, thin kindling and small pieces turn into smaller ash that will NOT make a good bed, as they simply fall right thru the holes in the coal grate.
You will need heavier pieces to produce larger coals that will block these holes.
THIS is why Bill K. tells us to use longer, larger diameter wood. The coals from this size best block the holes in the coal tray, maintaining that thick heat producing bed of coals.
NOW I fully understand why chips will not work well.
(Duh! The light bulb FINALLY comes on)

**BBQ_Bill** · November 13, 2018, 09:42 AM

Eureka moment for me...
Continually using small kindling, chips and small chunks for a cook will quickly OVERFILL your ash box below the coal grate.
Basically...
The more smaller pieces you use, the FASTER the ash box below fills up.
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Longer, larger diameter pieces make the best coal bed as they will provide higher heat due to holding their structure better and longer as they turn to coals and block the grate holes better as they collapse.
When they finally go through the holes, more time has passed and your long smokes will not fill the ash box up.
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Remember, ashes can only get so high in the ash box below the grate, and then they start being sucked thru the bottom poppet into the cook chamber and getting on the meat.

**Rfuilrez** · November 16, 2018, 04:16 PM

I made a couple door hinge pins for my KBQ at work today. It’s just a piece of 1/4 stainless rod with 2 snap ring grooves in it to go on either side of the door. (Don’t mind the dirty KBQ lol)

Originally I made the stick out 1/8â€, but it was too much. I knew it might be. I cut it down to about 1/16â€ and it fits nice now. Slightly bending the door, not enough to cause permanent deformation though, and it pops in and out. I’ll probably remake them out of larger stock to eliminate the outside snap ring and just put a shoulder on it. Also, it fits a little wobbly in the door holes. May or may not be a good thing. Gonna use it as is for a few cooks and cleanings and see what I think.

**BBQ_Bill** · November 18, 2018, 01:15 PM

I have been using the "Quick Pins" and so far, other than being a bit wobbly they seem to work fine. I DO like the mod you just made though. I have access to several lathes and slitter/part-off tools that would work well to cut the grooves.
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However, you COULD sell these sweet pins to the others here without full machine shop access.
Here below is my imagined pin that your guys or mine could build on a CNC lathe.

So Rfuilrez I will tell you that my guys "hate" single-pointing thread,
but will do it if in a bind.
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This second sketch shows threads versus the slot.
A washer and a nut will lock it up nicely.
I am thinking 300 series Stainless on all parts.
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They would run this as a 3/8" diameter bar and extend it about 1/2" to a stop.
Turn, single-point and then part off and use a tray to catch the parts as the conveyor takes them out.
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I too am a manual mill, manual lathe guy, but I go thru, correct, and then sign-off on the instructions for CNC and all other machine production procedures daily.
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What do you think sir?

**BBQ_Bill** · November 18, 2018, 02:09 PM

If you lose your coal bed in your KBQ firebox during a cook, that bed can be a royal pain to quickly build back up to size and cover those fire box grate holes.
You seriously NEED all holes WELL covered with a THICK bed of coals to get your heat back up for your cook.
- - -

You may lose about 45 minutes to an hour, however...
A chimney load of hot coals is really what is needed to rebuild that "dead" coal bed.
Playing around trying to do this in the KBQ while meat is in there is a real drag.
Trust me, I KNOW this from this weekends cook, as I was tired, it was 3:00 a.m. and I simply could not get my temperature up to 230°F for my rib cook after I slept thru my alarm and let the coal bed lapse.
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My experience and advice is to not even try to add kindling and rebuild that bed.
You will be fighting a battle that is incredibly hard to win.
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I like these 10 steps to success.
1) Shut off the power to the controller.
2) I then add a few pieces of kindling to get some flames going if possible or use a torch to help add more heat to ignite the kindling.
3) Being careful to not smother my "baby" flames, I add some larger wood.
4) I then switch the power back on to the controller.
5) Now I go and quickly fill a chimney with lump or charcoal.
6) I place that chimney load of charcoal or lump on top of the KBQ fire box.
(The coals will easily and quickly be lit with no need for paper)
7) After awhile and it is going well, I turn off the power again to the controller.
8) Then. use my fire tongs to remove the larger wood from the firebox.
9) Close up both poppets and pour the hot and ready coals into the firebox.
10) Finally I add the smoldering wood I removed, and restore power.
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In less than one hour, all is well again.

If you look closely, you can see that I scorched the handle.
Just keep it back a ways from the flames and you will be okay.

UPDATE:
Below is a unit you can add to your Propane tank and hose for starting that chimney.

**Rfuilrez** · November 18, 2018, 04:00 PM

BBQ_Bill yep that’s exactly right. Flexing the door is enough to let them pop in or out. Im gonna ask the CNC guys what it would take to run off about 20-30 pairs of them on the CNC lathe once I get a design I’m happy with. I’m just a manual mill/lathe guy.

This is how I start coals for all my bbq needs. It’s also how I recover from letting my coal bed die out. 1-2minutes with the regulator at full rip and wood or charcoals are ready to use. For starting my cook at the beginning I put it on a lowish flame and let it burn for about 5minutes.

I just put wood in there. Never even bother with lump for the KBQ.
It’s a $12 turkey frier burner from Amazon on a 0-20psi adjustable regulator hose.

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