What does "American Wagyu" mean?

[SJUfeller]

This comes from the prior thread, but I felt it could generate some questions . . . and help my business partners and I decide what to call the meat we sell.

First, the word "Wagyu" means Japanese beef cattle. "Wa" means Japanese and "gyu" means "cow". That's the easy part.

Unfortunately, adding the word American to Wagyu results in confusion.

Some say it means any U.S.-born calf that is at least 50% Wagyu. (Thus, a full-blood Wagyu born in the US would still be called "American Wagyu".)

Others say it means a U.S.-born calf that is specifically 50% Wagyu and 50% Angus. Still others say it means 50% Wagyu and 50% of some other breed (does not have to be Angus).

Given the lack of a clear definition, my partners and I decided just to refer to our Wagyu as "Fellers Ranch Wagyu". People ask, "Is it American Wagyu?", and we answer that all our calves are born in the US, so in that sense, "yes". However, almost all of our calves are 75% Wagyu or higher, with many being pure-breed Wagyu . . . so in that sense, they are not the "typical" American Wagyu.

So, that leads to these questions:

1. What does the term "American Wagyu" mean to you?
2. In deciding what to buy, would knowing the % of Wagyu make a difference to you?
3. If you were our marketing consultant, would you recommend the use of the term American Wagyu on our packaging?
4. Does the BMS score of Wagyu play a role in your decision on which Wagyu to buy? (Wagyu is ranked based on a BMS marbling score ranging from 3 - 12).

Thanks for your answers . . . which is free consumer market research for us!

Also, feel free to ask any questions about Wagyu. I certainly don't know everything, but I know much more than I did 5 years ago.

[ecowper]

Here's my thoughts on it for you

1. What does the term "American Wagyu" mean to you?

Eric: Cattle/Beef raised in the US, on high end ranches, that has Japanese heritage. I don't worry too much about percentage, more about the quality of the ranch, the cattle, and the fat marbling/content

2. In deciding what to buy, would knowing the % of Wagyu make a difference to you?

Eric: Maybe, but since there is no official definition, it might also seem like a meaningless marketing tactic sort of like "Organic" or "Free Range"

3. If you were our marketing consultant, would you recommend the use of the term American Wagyu on our packaging?

Eric: Yes. I would also recommend pictures of happy cows. Cause I like pictures of happy cows :-) .... but some easy to understand blurb on your packaging about American Wagyu and production methods would be powerful

4. Does the BMS score of Wagyu play a role in your decision on which Wagyu to buy? (Wagyu is ranked based on a BMS marbling score ranging from 3 - 12).

Eric: Yes, although I find the SRF approach of just two grades with a definition for the BMS of each grade to be easier to assess and make my buying decision.

[jfmorris]

1. What does the term "American Wagyu" mean to you?

Boy, do you hit the nail on the head when you say there is no clear definition of this. I've come to conclude that "American Wagyu" is an overused and often misused marketing term, that has been applied to so many cuts of meat I see that have no resemblance to Japanese Wagyu, especially the A5 stuff, that it is almost meaningless. When I first heard of the term, I thought it would mean it was premium beef, and maybe it is, but when I see pound packages of "wagyu" ground beef at Walmart along with the regular ground beef, for a buck or two more, it is a term that has been diluted.

I bought stuff a year or two ago from a ranch in Texas that was "red wagyu". It was good beef, but had no resemblance to the Japanese stuff. All that said though, I think your explanation of being at least 50% wagyu stock is reasonable.

I think on the surface, this entire misused American Wagyu term came about because the Japanese couldn't enforce infringement on it like they could with "Kobe beef", which is tightly controlled.

2. In deciding what to buy, would knowing the % of Wagyu make a difference to you?

I think it would. Just like knowing beef is certified black Angus for example, which gives me some assurance of grade and marbling.

3. If you were our marketing consultant, would you recommend the use of the term American Wagyu on our packaging?

Most likely yes, since folks currently expect that term to imply a premium product, and it helps justify paying a bit more.

4. Does the BMS score of Wagyu play a role in your decision on which Wagyu to buy? (Wagyu is ranked based on a BMS marbling score ranging from 3 - 12).

Since I am unfamiliar with the scale, it doesn't help me, unless I see a picture of the different grades of wagyu so I know what the BMS numbers mean.

[ecowper]

On #4 Jim it's why I like the SRF system of Black and Gold. I have very little clear picture in my head of the difference between BMS 5 and BMS 9 ..... but I can figure out that Black is the lower half of that spectrum and Gold is the upper half and that is helpful in figuring it out.

[SJUfeller]

Having a system like SRF does has merit. We have considered doing it, as many of the calves we've processed lately have scored 9 and 10 BMS -- which matches SNR's Gold label. The different labels would justify charging more for some of our product than we do. However, it also adds a ton of challenges with inventory control, bookkeeping, packaging, etc. As our economies of scale grow, we feel that that time is coming for us.

[CandySueQ]

I like the logic of "Fellers Ranch Wagyu" mainly because it identifies the source of the cow. There are great differences in percentages. Honestly, the very best brisket I've ever purchased came from Australian A9 cattle. A close second was a privately ranched herd, where dad grew cattle in LA and son (chef and butcher) sold beef in MS.


A9 Brisket

[rickgregory]

You asked... so...

1. What does the term "American Wagyu" mean to you?
A cow raised in the US (duh) which has a significant percentage of Kobe/Wagyu heritage. I assume around 50% but the exact percentage isn't important. HOWEVER, that it's significant IS. Calling something that was 10% Wagyu "American Wagyu" would feel dishonest to me.

2. In deciding what to buy, would knowing the % of Wagyu make a difference to you?
In cases like yours where it's well above the 50% I have in my mind, yes, it would be an advantage.

3. If you were our marketing consultant, would you recommend the use of the term American Wagyu on our packaging?
This is tricky since I don't work in food retail. But my take is that I would not. It's swiftly becoming like Angus, a term that's so over-used that it doesn't mean much.

4. Does the BMS score of Wagyu play a role in your decision on which Wagyu to buy? (Wagyu is ranked based on a BMS marbling score ranging from 3 - 12).
It doesn't but I'm the sort who likes more information when it's relevant so I'd note this with a link to what BMS means for those people like me. Obviously that assumes that this would put your product in a good light.

PS: The other day I was walking through a market here and saw some ground beef that was labelled American Wagyu... but I didn't buy it for that, I bought it because it was Mishima Reserve. That is, I bought it because I trust the brand. Whatever you do, I'd do to enhance your reputation for both quality and honesty so that when you say to people "this is quality wagyu" they trust it because it's you saying it.

[SJUfeller]

We have thus far stayed away from "American Wagyu" because that has become watered down. You specifically bought Mishima Reserve. Our goal is for people to specifically buy Fellers Ranch. In the Twin Cities, a growing number restaurant diners are now specifically asking for Fellers Ranch Wagyu, because they have had good experiences with it. We can control what meat goes out the door with the Fellers Ranch label. We can't control what other people label American Wagyu.

[rickgregory]

And that's why I'd avoid "American Wagyu" on the product. It's like seeing "Angus" on commodity beef. Now, "Certified Angus Beef" means something... much like "Feller Ranch Wagyu" could.

Another play would be to try to go t he CAB route and get together with other high quality ranches doing wagyu and do a "Certified Wagyu" branding thing but that's a huge project.

[grantgallagher]

Some really great questions.

If you want sales volume then yes, i think using the term american wagyu is a plus...especially if you are selling at a competitive price point. If you want to play in a more niche market with MUCH more discerning customers then probably not.

BMS matters a lot to me if im going to drop some pretty serious coin. Otherwise it matters less, i dont expect to see super high BMS at most places and its generally something i search out when i want something special. That said, if people dont know the scale but know its graded out of 12, the natural reaction to seeing something 4/5/6 out of 12 will just be to think its not as good even though it can still be pretty good. So its one of those weird ones that buys you a lot at the high end of the spectrum but may make people move on at the lower end and just look for something that visually looks better even unconsciously discounting how much the way cattle are raised matters.

The percentage wagyu probably matters less than anything else outside of if there are actually any kind of legal requirements. Even if there are, the actual % matters much less to me than the BMS rating. Basic marketing principle is if you are doing percentages...it depends on the customer knowledge of the market. I hate to say it, but if you say 50% american wagyu then you will get the questions of does that mean 50% american? 50% wagyu? So i think i would stay away from that one, personally.

I work in pharma marketing and typically time and time again i see that unless you have a wonder product then 59% vs 67% etc for whatever efficacy measure you are promoting just doesnt matter.

[SJUfeller]

As for the legal requirements, the USDA does have specifications (which are based on the American Wagyu Assoc. specs). The following is the "rule":

"Wagyu" means one of the parents was 93.75% Wagyu or above (so the calf is at least 46.875% Wagyu).
"Purebred Wagyu" means that it is 93.75 (15/16ths) Wagyu.
"Pureblood Wagyu" means that it is 100% Wagyu.

There is no set definition of American Wagyu that I am aware, but it seems common sense that it would be at least 46.875% Wagyu.

[SJUfeller]

Opps. I typed "Pureblood" for 100% Wagyu genetics. The proper term is "Fullblood"

[grantgallagher]

SJUfeller yeah, you would have to drop some money into market education for BMS if you want to hit the bigger sales volume. Im honestly not sure that would be worth it vs just getting some really good pictures, making sure you ship well to minimize loss and hassle, and increasing/maintaining customer satisfaction. This is the really dumb thing about marketing numbers, bar charts and graphs are largely boring to people. If you can find a way to translate it into something that matters...

[ecowper]

I think that the general meat buying public understands Prime > Choice > Select and that CAB = Prime. They are starting to get that Wagyu > Prime.

For people that spend a bit more time on such things, Wagyu now really comes down to the source. The better quality the producer, the better quality the meat, for most of us.

Emphasize your quality of production. Make Fellers a well respected name. That's the trick, I think. Then get some big name to rave about how great Fellers is so you can pull a Rancho Gordo!

[ecowper]

SJUfeller what about something like "Fireman, a Founding Member of the Pitmaster Club, has said ..... " .... that sort of thing can't hurt on your website

[SJUfeller]

ecowper seems like people know their stuff here, and a shout-out from anyone that tries and likes our product is appreciated! And from a founding member of the Pitmaster Club would be awesome!

[ecowper]

SJUfeller “Founding Member” means we joined The Pitmaster Club in the first 3 months (I think) when it was not a thing. Now it is the largest BBQ society in the world ….. I think gathering quotes …. Real quotes, based on our experience …. From Founding Members would be of value. I’d trade a quote for a brisket ;-)

[Spinaker]

Hear are my thoughst from a fellow Minnesotan to another.........

1. What does the term "American Wagyu" mean to you?
American Wagyu means to me that the steer is at least 50% Wagyu. I do not worry about a BMS rating at that point, but I do assume it will be at least 50% Wagyu.

2. In deciding what to buy, would knowing the % of Wagyu make a difference to you?
Yes, and I think it would to others as well. Additionally, having an explanation regarding what "Wagyu" actually means, similar to what you have above, for people to reference would be helpful. Especially since Wagyu can often have a sticker scare for some and they should know why it is so much more expensive. I would also make the point that you feel that the extra cost will be worth it for your consumer in the end.

3. If you were our marketing consultant, would you recommend the use of the term American Wagyu on our packaging?
I think the "American Wagyu" term is overused. "Fellers Ranch Wagyu" sets you apart fro the herd. It also peaks my interest......."What is Fellers Ranch Wagyu?" "How does it differ from American Wagyu?" I think this will help you grow your name as a premium brand that can be trusted.

4. Does the BMS score of Wagyu play a role in your decision on which Wagyu to buy? (Wagyu is ranked based on a BMS marbling score ranging from 3 - 12).
BMS does not play that big of a role for me. For example,, I really do not see the point in buying "Gold Grade Wagyu" from SRF. They claim a BMS rating of 9+ on all of their "Gold Grade" meats. (I do not refute those claims at all, I am not knowledgeable enough to do so) That being said, a BMS of 2-8 is just fine for me. To me, those few extra points are not really worth the additional cost. It is rich enough at BMS 2-8. I think for the most part the BSM rating is a marketing tool to show consumers how high quality the meat is. Which is great, to know as a consumer, but ultimately, I will settle for lower BMS rating to save a few bucks and I still have a killer BMS 4-8 hunk of meat!

[Jerod Broussard]

Is it always a steer?

[SJUfeller]

Thanks Spinaker.

Jerod -- no, not always a steer. For us, we are probably about 75% steers and 25% heifers. We select some of the best heifers for breeding purposes. (Steers also grow a bit faster and larger, which is good for our purposes.) We have not perceived any difference in the meat quality between steers and heifers.

[Huskee]

I would call it what you want, I like Feller's Ranch Wagyu- you know no one can copy that, and since the "__ Wagyu" terminology isn't clearly defined on the market or trademarked, you can lay claim on that. I would also, if I were your marketing director, clearly state on your listings and even your packaging how much actual "Wagyu" your steers are, and where they're born & raised. Then you are fully transparent and no one can critique your use of ill-defined fad terminology like American Wagyu.

[FireMan]

Keep it simple! Less & transparent as Huskee says. A book of info will put people to sleep. Gain their trust by doin what yer doin.

[ecowper]

This, I think, is my point. Establish your quality standard, live up to your quality standard, get people to recognize that.

[GolfGeezer]

My head hurts!! How about "Gaijin Wagyu"?

Seriously, I agree with those above about calling it what it is: Feller's Ranch Wagyu. It's funny 'cause I just bought a rack of Berkshire ribs and I realize I'm not clear on what that is - other than others on The Pit of exclaimed its virtues.

[ecowper]

Gaijin Wagyu .... brilliant!

[Draznnl]

I prefer the label ‘Feller’s Ranch Wagyu” for your marketing and packaging. On your website, I’d include a description of what qualifies for that moniker. Obviously, include your URL on your packaging.

[Jerod Broussard]

"Feller's Beef, it's what's for dinner."

Potential copyright/TM issues.

[tstalafuse]

I am not sure that a new or different marketing terms will make that much difference unless you can in someway make it so that I can compare apple to oranges in my pea brain. As with most members of the public, I know the USDA ratings, and now there appears to be grading being added for high/med/low inside each of the USDA grades that is being advertised. I know there is a grading system of Wagyu a higher number (A9, for example) being way better than some gross lower number. Now, I am learning there is a BMS scale. Plus, I was just on "XYZ" Ranch Wagyu's website where they are bragging about their Wagyu being 93% with an F4 rating, so now there is another rating scale to wonder about how it fits in comparison to the others.

[SJUfeller]

Great comments. The American Wagyu Association (and all in the industry) have their work to do in sending clear messages. Consumer confusion is not good for anyone.

[SJUfeller]

Thanks for all the ideas! All 5 of the Fellers (i.e. the partners in the business) are meeting tonight, and I will share some of what I have learned!

[ecowper]

I went and had a look at your website. Pondering getting something shipped :-)

[FireMan]

I’m not lookin fer anything, just want to lend a helping hand.
Bein somewhat of a dinosour, to order all I came up with is the Conger Bay or Bar somethin or other. Read pick up only. Just a bit of a drive fer me.

[SJUfeller]

FireMan The butcher shop (owned by a FR partner) is Conger Meat Market. 507-265-3340. Ask for Jeremy or Darcy, but anyone can help you. They can take info, and ship to you. Or, order from our website www.fellersranch.com. Or, come to the Conger or Albert Lea locations. Conger location is where processing is done, and the cattle are just one mile away -- if you want to see them. AL is just a retail store, although it does carry a large variety of FR product.