Moved to Europe, seeking advice on grass fed, leaner beef (especially tri-tip)

[PhotoJoseph]

A year ago I moved to Europe (Slovenia) from America, and even brought a brand new Weber kettle 26" big boy with me (they're 2x to 3x the price here… oof). Obviously in a different country the meat will be different, and in case you're wondering, the chicken and pork I get here blows away what I was getting in the US, at less than half the price. Beef, on the other hand, is very different here. Not only is it all grass fed, it's lean. Really lean. The butchers here pride themselves on how lean their beef is. The idea of a grilled steak is still a novelty here, and while people are slowly evolving to beef as something to be grilled and not just boiled for soup or put in a stew, they are still focused on its leanness.

I special ordered a couple of tri-tips recently from a local butcher, as that was always one of our favorite cuts back in the US. I do it Santa Maria style, had it down to a perfect science, and it was always my go-to crowd pleaser. First of all, the pieces from the local butcher were ginormous compared to what we used to get at Costco or any local butcher in Oregon. One tri-tip was 2.2kg (4.8 lbs) and the other is 3kg (6.6lb!). The smaller one is in the photo below. (The price, I'm happy to say, was great -- about $7.50 a pound. But they were so big the two of 'em cost me €80! Anyway…) Apparently the animals are slaughtered in the same 18-24 month window that they are in the US, although I'm going to verify that with my butcher as I've read that grass fed cows are often slaughtered older. Or maybe the size difference is attributed to different breeds. I don't know yet.

The point though, of this lengthy post other than to share some interesting info, is to get some advice on how to handle this. The leaner beef is tougher than what I'm used to, of course. It's all very tasty, but simply not as tender. The Santa Maria method is pretty low and slow, and I think this smaller one took about an hour to get to 130F, as expected. Tri-tip has to be cut just right to not be chewy on its best days, so I was hyper aware of that when slicing this up. It was absolutely delicious -- but, tougher than I want.

So… what methods can I use to get this more tender? I've made many brisket in America, and I'm well familiar with the sudden change in the muscle structure around 190F after a dozen hours on the smoker, but tri-tip ain't goin' to 190F! I have never tried sous vide on a tri-tip (and I don't even have one here, but they are available), so I wonder if I should do that. But I'd have to look up how long I can even safely hold it at the temp I'd want to do it at; I'd imagine a max of 125F for however many hours (four hours max I think) so I can finish it on the grill, but I don't know that the maximum time I could safely leave it in the bath at that temp would make a difference in its tenderness.

Any wisdom on grilling grass fed, leaner beef would be welcome here.

Hvala from Slovenia!

[jfmorris]

That is one MASSIVE tri tip!

I've seen posts on here of folks treating tri-tip like brisket, and smoking low and slow to higher temps (195+), but while that might work with a prime or waygu tritip, I sure don't think it will work on one that is super lean. And I think on the SV stuff, tenderizing means LOTS more than 4 hours, probably above 131F, as a 125F bath won't be safe for extended periods. 131F or slightly higher will be safer from a pathogen standpoint.

That's about all I got. Here in Alabama, tri-tip is rare to see in the stores, even Costco, and I've only mail ordered it a few times just to check it off my list.

Thanks for telling us how things differ there in Europe compared to the US. Interesting to know.

Henrik , while not in Slovenia, is in the same "neighborhood" of the world, and may have advice for dealing with it...

[Bkhuna]

Kenji Alt has done extensive testing of sous vide and timing. This should help you: https://www.seriouseats.com/food-lab...ous-vide-steak

My opinion is that sous vide would be the way to go with searing on the grill to finish.

Good luck.

[GolfGeezer]

For what it is worth, I always SV my tri-tips at 131*F for 6-8 hours. Dry them, season and let them sit while I get my SnS kettle roaring hot, usually about 30 minutes. Then sear the TT. Always tender, juicy. Obviously the cuts I use are mostly the Costco ones, and not grass fed. They are never overcooked as the searing does not raise the IT, or very little at most.

[Mosca]

Is it just Slovenian beef that is that lean, or all European beef? I know French, Italian, and Scottish beef all have a pretty strong reputation for flavor and succulence, despite being grass fed and finished.

[yakima]

You might try Italian salad dressing as an overnight marinade. It works well to tenderize fairly lean skirt steak. Perhaps cut your monsters into smaller chunks to provide more marinade surface. And slice across the grain when cooked.

[bbqLuv]

It is highly recommended that the tri-tip be tenderized. I us a Jaccard. The Tri-tip I buy from Costco come already tenderized.

[Henrik]

I don't live in Sweden, not Slovenia, but it's Europe anyways :-) And yes, the beef here is more often than not grass-fed and leaner. Grain finished beef is seen as "less authentic" here. Yes, it really helps with consistent quality from a production stand-point, but in Europe grass-fed is preffered. I've had both, and I prefer grain-finished brisket, for example, but grass-fed steak.

I've never done SV, so can't say anything on that subject, but I do what GolfGeezer does on the grill: low 'n slow (240° F) on the grill until almost tender. Let it rest for a few minutes, then sear it off real quick over high heat. In my experience the (grass-fed) tri tip is very sensitive when it comes to target temp. Overshoot by 3 degrees, and it's perceived as dry. In your case I would aim for a target temp of 56° C / 132.8° F. That means you remove it from the low 'n slow grill when internal temp is 48° C, and no higher. It will move up to 50° C while resting, and with a quick sear on both sides it should just "slide" up to 56° C.

A final tip on getting it juicy is holding it (loosely tented with foil) at 56 for 10 minutes before slicing into it. I know Meathead is not a fan, but it means less juice runs out when you slice it.

[BFlynn]

Leaner cuts, I like to SVQ to medium-rare (beef) or medium (venison) temp.

Troutman has some good write ups, on it

[PhotoJoseph]

So many great responses here, thank you! Replying to all below…

That is one MASSIVE tri tip!

Right?!

I've seen posts on here of folks treating tri-tip like brisket, and smoking low and slow to higher temps (195+), but while that might work with a prime or waygu tritip, I sure don't think it will work on one that is super lean. And I think on the SV stuff, tenderizing means LOTS more than 4 hours, probably above 131F, as a 125F bath won't be safe for extended periods. 131F or slightly higher will be safer from a pathogen standpoint.

Definitely agreed I don't want to go anywhere near brisket temps. I've found over the years that, while I prefer my steaks around 125F, that tri-tip is better around 135F. Which I can use to my advantage here.

Thanks for telling us how things differ there in Europe compared to the US. Interesting to know.

Yeah! I figured some folks might find it interesting ;-)

Kenji Alt has done extensive testing of sous vide and timing. This should help you: https://www.seriouseats.com/food-lab...ous-vide-steak

Excellent, thank you. The key is that cooking over 130F doesn't limit the time. Since I prefer my tri-tip around 135F, I think I can make this work.

For what it is worth, I always SV my tri-tips at 131*F for 6-8 hours. Dry them, season and let them sit while I get my SnS kettle roaring hot, usually about 30 minutes. Then sear the TT.

OK, this is extremely helpful. Knowing you've done it for so long at 131F is really really great to hear. Thanks! I am concerned that this will sacrifice some BBQ smoke flavor, however I think that's an acceptable trade-off for tenderness.

Is it just Slovenian beef that is that lean, or all European beef? I know French, Italian, and Scottish beef all have a pretty strong reputation for flavor and succulence, despite being grass fed and finished.

I can't say. Grass fed is certainly the norm here, and I've had a pretty amazing fattier steak in Slovakia, so the leanness may well be a Slovenian thing. Historically here, beef is just used for soup and stew. They'll cook the ever loving hell out of it, and while it does make for some delicious stews and soups, that's where it ends. Funny thing is that they are starting to get into dry aging here, but they'll dry age for only two weeks and mark it way up in price. I'm not about to debate a Balkan butcher with a battle axe knife about the pointlessness of a short dry age, so I just walk on by.

You might try Italian salad dressing as an overnight marinade. It works well to tenderize fairly lean skirt steak. Perhaps cut your monsters into smaller chunks to provide more marinade surface. And slice across the grain when cooked.

Interesting, although I don't think it'd penetrate such a big cut. As far as cutting it smaller to marinade; that'd certainly help although I'm trying to maintain a certain expectation here; I have my traditional Santa Maria style that I'm trying to replicate. And to cutting across the grain -- oh, always. Tri-tip certainly has part of the chunk where I swear the grain changes direction half-way through a cut, but yes, I'm well aware of the importance of cutting it just right.

It is highly recommended that the tri-tip be tenderized. I us a Jaccard. The Tri-tip I buy from Costco come already tenderized.

Interesting x2! I've never tenderized with a Jaccard (I'll have to look for one here), and my tri-tips have, to my knowledge, never been punched full of holes from Costco. Fascinating!

I don't live in Sweden, not Slovenia, but it's Europe anyways :-) And yes, the beef here is more often than not grass-fed and leaner. Grain finished beef is seen as "less authentic" here. Yes, it really helps with consistent quality from a production stand-point, but in Europe grass-fed is preffered. I've had both, and I prefer grain-finished brisket, for example, but grass-fed steak.

Interesting about the "less authentic". I hadn't heard that but I do know that generally here people say grass fed is superior. But then, they come to America and rave about the steak. So… :-) I personally think grass fed with a grain finish is the way to go.

I've never done SV, so can't say anything on that subject, but I do what GolfGeezer does on the grill: low 'n slow (240° F) on the grill until almost tender. Let it rest for a few minutes, then sear it off real quick over high heat.

That's exactly the technique I've always used, getting the meat to about 128F or so before searing.

In my experience the (grass-fed) tri tip is very sensitive when it comes to target temp. Overshoot by 3 degrees, and it's perceived as dry. In your case I would aim for a target temp of 56° C / 132.8° F. That means you remove it from the low 'n slow grill when internal temp is 48° C, and no higher. It will move up to 50° C while resting, and with a quick sear on both sides it should just "slide" up to 56° C.

This beast was definitely not dry. Just too tough. And your temperatures are right where I target.

A final tip on getting it juicy is holding it (loosely tented with foil) at 56 for 10 minutes before slicing into it. I know Meathead is not a fan, but it means less juice runs out when you slice it.

Yep, I do let it rest although unless I need to transport it, I don't foil it. That softens the crust too much, IMHO. But yeah doing the whole faux-cambro thing with foil and towels in a cooler is an amazing way to hold a cooked beast at temperature for hours!

If you find yourself in Slovenia… let's grill!

Leaner cuts, I like to SVQ to medium-rare (beef) or medium (venison) temp.

Never cooked venison but I could see that, being so lean, it'd benefit from that. Interesting.

Troutman has some good write ups, on it

I'll look him up, thanks.

RECAP

So I think its worth doing the sous vide. I'll do a 131F bath for six to eight hours and finish on the grill. I'm certainly concerned that will sacrifice some of the smokiness, but maybe if I super smoke it while searing I can get some of that back, at least on the surface.

We're planning a BBQ in a month for some international friends (need people to help eat that nearly 7 lb monster!) so I have some time to collect the necessary tools.

Thanks again to everyone who responded. So much good info here!

[58limited]

Alternatively you can SV it to get it tender, cool it and refrigerate, and then smoke it to bring it back up in temperature then sear it.

[bbqLuv]

Tri-tip at Costco are blade tenderized and labeled.

[Donw]

Just an observation but when I see such a large tri-tip it may suggest that additional areas of the sirloin area could still be attached such as parts of the sirloin tip or the bavette. Nothing wrong with that but I’d look carefully at all the grain directions before cooking to ensure your slicing pattern yields the tenderest slices from all areas.

Then again I could be wrong and Slovenia just produces some high yielding cattle.

[JCBBQ]

All I know is that my Dutch FIL wants a big ass American steak every time he visits. So you’re not alone. But I’ve got nothing, sorry.

[fzxdoc]

So many great responses here, thank you! Replying to all below…

Interesting x2! I've never tenderized with a Jaccard (I'll have to look for one here), and my tri-tips have, to my knowledge, never been punched full of holes from Costco. Fascinating!

In a nutshell, you may not want to jaccard a piece of meat that you won't be taking to pathogen-free temp of 160°. There are topics here describing how Costco takes additional steps to ensure food safety with their jaccarded meats.

Meathead has an article on the free side about food safety and using jaccards.

https://amazingribs.com/jaccard-blade-tenderizers/

When I SV most meats, I use pasteurization times as opposed to heating times. For pasteurization times for several cuts of meat at various thicknesses and set temps, see the chart on this link. Scroll down past the cooking times charts for the pasteurization times charts.

As a point of reference, here's the chart for pasteurization times for beef, lamb, and pork from that link:


And here is the description from that website that discusses this chart:



Hope this info helps.

And thank you for the interesting post about meats in Europe. Enjoy your stay in Slovenia. I bet it's beautiful there.

Kathryn

[Bkhuna]

"She blinded me with science...."

[RobertC]

fzxdoc's Pasteurization chart for beef, lamb, and pork.

[RobertC]

My observation about the supply of beef in France is that it's dominated by breeds of dairy cattle, so they tend to be grass-fed (or milk-fed, for veal). There are breeds like Charolais and Limousin that are sort of dual-purpose, but the dairy industry is so dominant that the beef tends to be a secondary thought. In a nutshell, you either end up with a ton of cheeses and veal, or you end up with beef and American cheese. So the beef in France is much more lean, and you end up cooking beef differently than in the US. That's why the classic beef dishes are long slow braises and grilling never took off in France like in the US.

So on those rare occasions when I end up grilling (charcoal is different there, too), I often do either marinades or something similar, and when I do true barbecue I start with sous vide.