Choosing a Stick Burner

[bmcleveland313]

Hello!

Long time reader, new member here and would love your advice. I am interested in buying my first stick burner and am trying to land on the right one. I've been using a WSCG for about two years as my first foray into smoking after grilling on a gasser for about 4 years prior and have loved the versatility it provides, but I'm after the "holy grail" bbq flavor profile of pure wood. I will likely keep the WSCG for grilling needs and 'hands off' smoking. Here's several notes:

• Narrowed down to KBQ, traditional offset (probably Peoria Custom Cookers as I can drive there to minimize shipping, but am open), Engelbrecht Braten 1000 (I know the grilling function is duplicative, but the prospect of cooking meat over open flames is just carnally satisfying along with smoking)
• Budget up to $4.5k total, but would like to stay around $3k or less if possible
• Cook for immediate family, but would want capacity for 10-15 person gatherings. I also like to cook in bulk, vacuum seal, deep freeze.
• Wife-imposed limit of two cookers total
• Don't mind tending fire. I do have two young kids (3 or less), but will always be around the cooker if they're outside so not sure this is a huge issue
• I like to cook year-around, which means single digits in Iowa over winter along with generally disappointing weather in all extremes the rest of the year
• Cooker would be stored in garage and moved to pavement during cook, or on pavers in the backyard.
• I haven't had the need to transport the smoker from my house and I don't foresee my wife allowing me to do competitions anytime soon.
• I do have a general desire to learn the art of managing fires like the experts do, which is probably why I haven't automatically went with KBQ. This may be dumb and I'm open to being talked out of it though.

Let me know if I'm missing helping info and if you have any thoughts. Thanks so much!

[ofelles]

Welcome from the California Delta.
Take a look at Lone star Grillz in Texas https://lonestargrillz.com/ and
Lang Smokers in Georgia https://langbbqsmokers.com/ They are both tops in quality and offer many models.

[ofelles]

bmcleveland313 FYI when you want to tag someone this is how. mrteddyprincess

[Steve B]

I will second the Lone Star Grillz. See my Avatar.
If you have any questions about them PM me and I will gladly answer them.
SteveB

[mrteddyprincess]

bmcleveland313 you are right. In my experience with the Lang it is not necessary for anything to be insulated. Listen to Steve B and check out Lone Star Grillz. They are hella cool.

[bbqLuv]

Lang, is the one I wood get. But alas, luv me pellet smoker/grill.

[bmcleveland313]

Certainly not alone in that recommendation - thanks for the input!

[TripleB]

I own a Jambo offset, so here are my 2 cents:

1. KBQ is not an offset. Not saying anything negative about these smokers since I don’t own one or ever smoked on one. But I know you are constrained by wood size and it does not like charcoal.
2. A Lang is not an offset. It’s a reverse flow. They are great smokers.
3. You want a double insulated firebox, especially where you are. It will save on fuel.
4. ​​​​​​​1/4 inch rolled steel for the chamber.
5. you will learn to manage a fire for smoking and it takes awhile to learn. The more you smoke on it, the faster the learning curve. There are no ATC’s for offsets.
6. I will say this, the best smoked meat comes off a wood smoker, which an offset is. They beat a pellet pooper, WSM, Kamado, big green egg or whatever is out there every day of the week. ​​​​​​​
7. If it is just your "general" desire to learn how to manage a fire, then think long and hard about buying an offset. There is no middle ground with an offset. Your with it from beginning to end. So if your smoking a 16lb brisket, you’re looking at 15+ hours managing a fire. And if your meat does not come out the way you wanted, the first thought you have is "what a waste of time". My longest smoke was 24 hrs straight....just me.
8. ​​​​​​​if it sounds like I’m trying to talk you out of it, I am. A good offset is around 3K. Big investment. You can buy a lot of smaller smokers (e.g. WSM) and upgrade them with ATC’s, rib hangers, etc. for a lot cheaper and you can sleep through the night.

[TripleB]

bardsleyque - reminds me when I had young children. We trained our babies to sleep through the night. After two weeks, I was bragging to friends at work that we got our baby to sleep through the night. When I told my wife, she said "no, that was not true". She said to me, "the baby’s not sleeping through the night, you are". Opps.

[bmcleveland313]

Oh yeah, I hear you loud and clear. I've already got the WSCG with ATC, and it's nice, but I want the pure wood flavor and am willing to do what it takes to get it. bardsleyque you are correct, very well acquainted with sleepless nights!

[Beefchop]

Not to quibble too much but a Lang is still an offset. It just uses a reverse flow design (vs. a traditional design) to channel smoke and heat that are both generated in a firebox that is offset from the main cook chamber.

[glitchy]

Welcome to the Pit neighbor. I like your choice in grills already as I also have a WSCG. I've played with a COS for a short while and realized that it's not worth it to go cheap with an offset. Another problem is like TripleB mentioned above, here we really need 1/4" chamber along with an insulated or 1/2" thick firebox which really drives the cost up...unless you are only planning on using it from May thru October. I keep watching Marketplace and Craigslist, but quality offsets don't show up here very often and I too have checked out Peoria Cookers online.

Unless I find a really good deal on a quality used offset, I'm probably going to go the KBQ route for a stick burner some day. If you haven't already you should go through the KBQ threads here:
https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...q-~-has-landed
https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...-kbq-roll-call

Other than the KBQ, you'll get a 100 different recommendations for the best stick burner and they are all probably right. There are a lot of good cookers out there and the biggest key to any grill is just learning your grill and how it behaves and reacts.

and to add #9 to the list above (since I didn't see it):
9. Make sure you have access to the types of woods you want to burn and a good place to store it.

Edit: Also to add, I did see an offset on Craigslist a while back that was custom made locally. It disappeared pretty quick, but you might keep a watch there and see if he lists anything else...maybe you could custom order one if you got his contact info.

[glitchy]

Spinaker might be able to chime in about winter fuel consumption on the KBQ. As far as wood sourcing my plans changed a few months ago when my great uncle passed away and the farm with timber went up for sale.

[EdF]

When i bought the KBQ it was Feb and I wasn't waiting to use it. I don't find it a heavy fuel consumer, and don't find winter vs summer very different either. I could be mesmerized by watching the flames though.

I'd say having a windbreak of some kind is your best preventative measure.

[Spinaker]

Yeah, I would say it does burn more wood when it is really cold, but no that much more. Of course, it all depends on how hot you are cooking. I did a batch of hot and fast ribs and it took about an hour at 350 F. I bet I went through 8-10 beer car sized logs. So maybe 2 fireplace logs.

[DavidNorcross]

I really cannot weigh in on this one, but welcome from Virginia!

[bmcleveland313]

Thank you!

[Donw]

Staying in the Midwest area have you looked at the Yoders from Kansas?

[bmcleveland313]

I sure have. I think my thought process will go "offset vs other" > if offset, which one? So many choices, but seem like all good ones.

[tbob4]

I won't help with what you should buy but I will say if the wife says "go for it" go for it. Plus, your are young as evidenced by the age of your kids. You will be able to stay up with the fire on long cooks. I have a couple of wood burning cabinets. It doesn't get really cold where I live - the winter is so cold you would call it warm. Having not cooked in true cold weather, others will have much better advice than I do. Make sure you join the Pit before the trial runs out and keep us updated about your choice.

[bmcleveland313]

You know, I was floored when my wife gave me the okay to get a trailer mounted offset stored in the garage so she wouldn't have to look at it in the backyard. It's the "yes" that's usually the limiting factor!

[Santamarina]

Welcome from California! I’ve been running an offset for several years and have learned the art of managing a fire to keep temps just right and the smoke thin and blue. It’s a lot of work...which is what leads me to the KBQ. I kinda feel like I’ve "earned" the right to have some automation in the process, but I’m not 100% sure that’s the way I want to go.

The other pit on my short list is the Sniper from Pitmaker in TX. Great capacity. Killer build. And you still manage the fire yourself, so you can brag about your skills!

http://www.pitmaker.com/product/vin/?vin=34409731

[ofelles]

Pitmaker does good work. It was between them and LGS for my cabinet.

[bmcleveland313]

Well snap, thanks for complicating my decision further! That thought has crossed my mind though on getting over the learning curve and then just buying a KBQ after earning my stripes. No question KBQ is a triumph of engineering, but I imagine there's a certain amount of satisfaction managing the fire themselves for some people.

[RonB]

Welcome to The Pit. Sorry, but no stick burner experience...

[bmcleveland313]

Thank you!

[Huskee]

Fun choices ahead. Offsets are a lot of work but if you realize that going in, and you have the ability to acquire and store firewood, then it's not really that bad. I rarely have any cook, whether a dozen pork butts or a single packer brisket, take much over 12hrs, but I wrap after the stall I don't go unwrapped. 5am to 5 or 6pm of putting a chunk of wood on a fire every 30mins isn't a hard day to me, it's relaxing, aside from getting up early. And whether you choose reverse flow or standard flow offset truly means very little. KBQs are popular, and while they eliminate the need for you to hold a steady temp, as mentioned they still need tended just as often, require a little more specific size pieces of wood and they need a power outlet. The Engelbrecht sure looks fun too. I don't recall anyone who has one commenting specifically on their ease of use with a long low & slow, but I suppose you learn any equipment you have. Happy choosing!

[bmcleveland313]

I appreciate that comment on timing - I haven't ever had a cook go over 12 hours (I usually smoke at 250 or so), except when I stay at 225. My schedule is similar to yours in that I get up early with a target dinner time of 6 or 7pm after resting. I find that I'm "doing something" to the WSCG or meat a couple times an hour for most of the day anyway, so I'm hoping it won't be a huge jump in commitment.

[SmokeyNate]

+1 for the KBQ. I have had mine almost a year now and haven't regretted it. I was in the same decision making process you were this time last year. I wanted the strong smoke flavor that only wood can bring. It was a bit of a learning curve at first but its the only cooker I've used that I was able to turn out some great BBQ without a lot of trial and error. The first cook in my PBC was barely edible

The only couple of negatives to the KBQ is that you need power to run it and if its a really dry windy day I wont use it since the firebox isn't totally enclosed. I have used my gasser as a windbreak a time or to though. Yes, its a little bit of a pain to cut splits in half so they are short enough to fit in the firebox but I usually cut enough ahead of time to last me awhile. You do have to tend the fire throughout the cook by giving the coal bed a stir and adding a chunk of wood about every 30-40 minutes. The awesome thing is that you can adjust the intensity of the smoke flavor to your liking. I have never had any creosote or bitter flavor off of anything I have cooked even with both poppets fully open.

It truly is a great design and a well made smoker. I would highly recommend them to anyone. Lots of good info on them here too.

[bmcleveland313]

Thanks for the insight! Yeah, I've gotten as far as having the KBQ in the cart ready to order and haven't seen a dissatisfied owner yet. The small footprint, relative mobility, and cheaper price are pretty strong draws too. Both of my potential locations will have an outlet, so should be good.

[Loren]

I can't speak to specific smokers (my stick burner was a custom job I found on Craigslist), but stick burners are fun! They do have a learning curve though, so be aware and mindful of yourself and you will figure it out

Just figure a good supply of wood (where I used to live a cord of Oak cost ~$400 dollars 😱)...or spend sometime scouring CL and offerup.

I had some of the most enjoyable times tending the firebox as the sun came up, drinking coffee and sitting throwing wood in as needed.

[Loren]

I'm an addict to caffeine....and I need something to put the Irish Cream in😎

But I always have some beers ready for midday refreshments. And lunch refreshments. And dinner refreshments, as well as midafternoon, predinner and dinner refreshments. One can never be TOO prepared for hydrating refreshments. 🤣

[Steve B]

Sooo true 😂

[bmcleveland313]

Oh yeah, I'm trying to find a steady wood supply at the moment. And I agree, few things as primitively satisfying as tending fire!

[Smoldering Flea]

Is the Engelbrecht large enough for you? 29"x17" cooking grate. Their website says there is an 8-10" hotspot near the firebox, so you're at 20x17". So i'm thinking it would fit a single brisket or 2 pork butts or however many ribs you could fit in a rib rack. In all of those scenarios, you're probably good for 10 people. 15 doubtful. And the idea of a party plus copious leftovers is a no-go unless you can jerry-rig something to reduce the hot spot or go vertical within the cookbox. This vs. KBQ or offsets with 3-4x the usable cookspace.

On the flip side, if the novelty of staying up for 12 hours gets old, you still have what looks to be a high quality all wood-fired grill to fall back on vs. the others; and its not like you couldn't feed 15 using both the WCSG and Engelbrecht.

[bmcleveland313]

Yes, great points. The smaller size is a tradeoff with the Engelbrecht. The capacity you listed is about what I can get smoking with the WSCG, so I think you're right on the money feeding up to 15 with both (and it's not like the WSCG produces bad bbq - just not the best). Going vertical is a good idea - I will ask the owner about that, along with its low and slow capabilities vs traditional offsets. Thanks for the insight!

[PaynTrain]

Welcom bmcleveland313 ! I went with the loaded Yoder Durango, which you can see here https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...in-has-arrived
and here

https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/forum/log-burners/yoder-smokers/249902-bacon-smoke-on-yoder-durango

I love this grill. I have cooked so much food on it. It is tricky keeping temps up though in the bitter Northern Ohio winters, so be prepared!! Good luck with your adventure, from what I am reading, you won't go wrong.