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Sous Vide Technique - Purge

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  • Potkettleblack
    Club Member
    • Jun 2016
    • 1784
    • Chicago, IL
    • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330
      Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
      For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
      Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi
      Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something)

    Sous Vide Technique - Purge

    Purge is the term I have been taught for the stuff that is extracted from the item when cooking sous vide. In the attached picture is a chuck roast I did for 54 hours at something like 133*F. All that stuff that is in the bag is the splash of liquid smoke I put in the bag and the purge. Oh, and the chuckie.

    Purge can be culinary manna. But, following instructions like "reduce the juices from the bag" or "add the bag juice to your favorite BBQ sauce" can produce ugly result with off flavors.

    Purge contains a number of proteins in water. Albumin is the problem. If you're up on your food science, you may remember albumin from egg whites, where it's the primary protein in the firm part of the egg white.

    If you've ever tried to reduce your purge, you've likely gotten a cloudy result with a muddled flavor. We have the technology, we can rebuild the purge into something golden.

    -Work in progress-
    Attached Files
  • Potkettleblack
    Club Member
    • Jun 2016
    • 1784
    • Chicago, IL
    • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330
      Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
      For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
      Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi
      Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something)

    #2
    Here's the process.

    Remove item from bag. Move liquid to a microwave safe container that will not allow it to boil over. Should look like:
    Click image for larger version

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    Nuke for a minute. If it hasn't fully separated, nuke for another 30 seconds. You want to see this look like:

    Click image for larger version

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    From that picture you can see where this is going next. Generally, a mesh strainer is sufficient for most needs. But if you intend to build a sauce out of it, the coffee filter or a fine mesh strainer, like a chinois is worth the effort.
    Click image for larger version

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    Mmmmmm... albumin. Pitch it. doesn't have much flavor, mucks up anything you put it in... trash it is. If someone ever comes up with a good use for it... I will open a business selling it.

    Your final result, depending on how well you filtered it:
    Click image for larger version

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    Since I put my chuckie in the bag after a 12 hour dry brine, with a dash of liquid smoke, this purge was like the purest beef broth ever. I added it back to the meat that I shredded from the chuck, just like you might shred your chuckie in foil with onions and peppers and the juice. If I were more motivated, I might kick up the umami of this with some fish sauce or some tamari. I might add it to a BBQ sauce and reduce it to the desired consistency (I'm not sure why this is recommended, but I might give it a go). I might use it where I would use beef stock in a red wine reduction. Lots of places to take it.

    ----
    A couple of things about purge. If you have surface salt on your SV item, you will have salty purge (that sounds lewd). If you have herbs on the surface of your meat, you will have herby purge. Whatever is on the surface will infuse the purge. SV is an extractive cooking method. It will cook flavor in at the surface, a lot like Doc Blonder's marinade and brine experiments. So, consider, if you intend to use the purge (generally a good idea), how you want it flavored, before seasoning. I cook a lot of my sous vide completely naked, or just with some light salt or butter. I'm not saying that's the 100% right thing to do in all cases, but it's what works for me.

    Comment


    • jackralph
      jackralph commented
      Editing a comment
      a few questions. As it is lamb I am ultimately planning for, which is a little salty to begin with, I should be really aiming for what, a 1/4 tsp per pound of salt? For a boneless leg, how long to cook, & at what temp? This is a little out there for christmas dinner, but we are going with East Indian theme. (mix of carnivores & stooped vegans, so Indian flavours work) Lamb plan is tandoori flavours. I want it to be rare side of medium.

    • jackralph
      jackralph commented
      Editing a comment
      Can I put Tandoori spice mix in bag while SV'ing? I don't use yogurt on my lamb when doing tandoori... thanks in advance for any input. You guys Rock!

    • Potkettleblack
      Potkettleblack commented
      Editing a comment
      I’m not sure why lamb is inherently salty, but yes, reduce salt over what you would brine with. I would not add tandoori spices to the bag, if you are planning on reducing the purge.
  • Jerod Broussard
    Moderator
    • Jun 2014
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    #3
    Neat. Not sure what they say now, but back in college nutrition they said that egg albumin was one of the most nearly perfect proteins because of its high digestibility and it's nearly perfect amino acid sequence.

    I typically hurry up and ditch the purge before the wife sees it and completely grosses out.

    Comment


    • Potkettleblack
      Potkettleblack commented
      Editing a comment
      Nutritionally, it's a great protein. I'd rather eat it in egg whites. I've tasted the congealed grey goo, and... not really.

      Wife hates the name purge.

    • binarypaladin
      binarypaladin commented
      Editing a comment
      I wonder if it would work as "smoothie fodder." It sounds gross but it'd probably disappear in a decent smoothie. I wonder what dehydration and pulverizing would produce (besides a lot of work).
  • Mitrakas
    Former Member
    • Jun 2016
    • 109
    • Marlboro, MA

    #4
    Great post and thank you.

    Comment


    • l'inferno
      l'inferno commented
      Editing a comment
      I second that. TY
  • John Henry
    Charter Member
    • Apr 2015
    • 39
    • The great desert Southwest. If you don't mind 115-degrees in June, we can enjoy outdoor-cooking all
    • Don't Stop Believin'

    #5
    Potkettleblack, Would be grateful to offer some thoughts on your AWESOMELY-HELPFUL SV post here:

    imho--Can't say enough about your main point--capturing, filtering and utilizing the purge is one of the TREMENDOUS benefits of SV. It is absolute nectar as flavor for sauce or simply as an au jus addition at serving time.

    Also, your wise note of caution regarding salt levels when meat is in the bag for SV is spot-on advice. I still believe that a little salt is necessary and dry brining prior to SV has been much more effective for me than not, but one must be very, very careful with salt levels going into the SV bag.

    In my experience, that means to be sure to have at least 24 hours of dry brine time to allow a lighter amount of salt to work into the meat.

    You list some great ideas for boosting umami for SV--Another good umami source in the bag is Bragg's Aminos; I have had great luck with it providing a great background as a flavor base, but it is another salty ingredient so one has to know that when planning salt levels for the dry brine.

    Meat properly SV'ed then onto the grill for smoke and sear has been excellent, in my experience, thanks to great comments and direction also to some of the All-Stars on the AR Crew, Mr. Broussard, Mr. Potkettleblack and Mr. Breadhead chief among them. My thanks goes to them all and apologies am not listing all the ladies and gents whom have helped me; so many great sources are what sets AR miles apart from all the other sites; I will try to list the other All-Star contributors at a later time in an effort to note my appreciation to them all.

    Finally, a note on politics, sex and religion: (OK, OK, I am only kidding, dear Moderators)--It would be GREAT if I always had the time to be able to deal with a multi-hour smoke, and I find NO FAULT with those who advocate traditional smoking ONLY as their most pure and natural first choice. You all set a standard of excellence, and I celebrate your accomplishments and examples.

    Yet when my schedule will absolutely not permit me time for a full-on smoking session, 12 to 24+ largely unsupervised hours in the SV followed by some limited time for smoke and searing has allowed me to leverage my time (always due to unalterable demands from job or family). And at least around our house, the SV route has resulted in many dozens of happy diners who have greatly enjoyed the results. So the way I see it, having the two options to turn out quality "vittles" for my family and friends is what I call a win-win, and would NEVER have happened here without the great people at The Pit at Amazing Ribs and my very valuable membership.

    Comment

    • David C
      Founding Member
      • Jul 2014
      • 104
      • Bay Area, California
      • Cookers:
        Memphis Advantage w. Searing insert option
        Bradley 6-rack digital
        Thermal bath for sous vide, pressure cooker, etc.

        Time & Temp:
        iGrill2 & iGrill wireless thermometers used with iPhone 5
        Drawer full of various Maverick models

        BBQ Interests:
        Love smoking ribs, pulled pork, salmon, sablefish, rib roasts, sausages, lox, beef ribs, and brisket when I can -- strictly for friends, fun, etc.

        Websites:
        http://www.cardinalphoto.com
        http://www.sousvide.org

      #6
      Potkettleblack -- Thanks for the great tip about straining. Like Jerod Broussard, I mostly just dump the purge, but have always thought that it should be good for something.

      Comment

      • Meathead
        BBQ Whisperer, Mythbuster
        • May 2014
        • 1133
        • Chicago area
        • Remember, no rules in the bedroom or kitchen
          Meathead

        #7
        GREAT work brother! Building the knowledgebase!

        Comment


        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          Honored. You've upped my game a ton.
      • David Parrish
        Founding Member - Pit Boss Emeritus
        • May 2014
        • 5034
        • Charlotte, NC
          • Slow 'N Sear Kamado (SnSK)
          • Lots of grills that work with Slow 'N Sear
          • LOTS of digital thermometers (my fav)
          • LOTS of accessories
          • Favorite Beer - Fat Tire
          • Favorite Bourbon - Woodford Reserve
          • Favorite White Wine - Cakebread Chardonnay
          • Favorite Red Wine - Yes, Please

        #8
        Excellent info. Stickied and Featured!

        Comment

      • chudzikb
        Charter Member
        • Dec 2014
        • 181

        #9
        I utilized the purge in a very nice way today. From a nice old hunk of angus beef that had been bathing for about 20 hours. Poured in the dogs dish, added her food, and she was in nirvana. There you have it...

        Comment


        • EdF
          EdF commented
          Editing a comment
          Can't believe it - my 4 pound puppies wouldn't touch it.

          So what if you don't own a microwave?

        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          You could boil it, then clarify it.

        • EdF
          EdF commented
          Editing a comment
          Thanks, pretty much what I figured, but I was looking for easy answers! ;-)
      • Jerod Broussard
        Moderator
        • Jun 2014
        • 9037
        • East Texas
        • Pit Barrel Cooker "Texas Brisket Edition"
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          Cambro Model 300MPC110 w/ Winco SS Pans
          B & B and Kingsford Charcoal
          B & B Pellets

        #10
        Just collected some purge. Lotta albumin coming out a 6 pound roast. Both the purge and the roast are in the fridge chillin' until smoke-30. 100% sure I have a salty purge so I will keep that in mind as I progress.

        Comment


        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          Just taste it after filtering and if you're going to reduce, don't salt without tasting.
      • Michael Brinton
        Club Member
        • May 2016
        • 250

        #11
        Just did a few rib eyes sv and utilized the purge technique to add to a simple mustard sauce. Just chicken stock, Dijon mustard, butter, adding the purge (microwaved, strained) then a slight reduction. I've done that simple sauce a hundred times but just that slight addition added a complexity... wow! My five year old won't touch sauces but this time she was dipping her steak in.

        Comment

      • Potkettleblack
        Club Member
        • Jun 2016
        • 1784
        • Chicago, IL
        • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330
          Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
          For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
          Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi
          Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something)

        #12
        For my Thanskgiving turkey parts, I did a brine in bag of 1.5% by weight of turkey meat with 5-2 salt-sugar mix. If you recall your Blonder on Marinades, you will note this is all stuff that will penetrate well, and since it's going in a bag and hot, it will penetrate fast. With some sage leaves in the dark meat bag, this made a most glorious turkey stock for gravy.

        Comment


        • Michael Brinton
          Michael Brinton commented
          Editing a comment
          I did my dark meat on the smoker, but did my breast in the style you mentioned. Really great.
      • Bruce54
        Club Member
        • May 2016
        • 115
        • Portland, OR
          • Napoleon PRO22K-LEG Rodeo
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          • Anova Sous Vide circulator
          • VacMaster PRO350 vacuum sealer
          • Beer: Deschutes Black Butte Porter
          • Whisky: Glendronach 18 "Allardice"

        #13
        So, what if you took the filtered out albumin, threw it in a pan with a little oil / fat of choice, and browned it up? Just a speculation, but wouldn't the post Maillard reaction bits be a close relative to the drippings in a roasting pan? I haven't tried this, but maybe following the next SV chuck ...

        Comment


        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          You are welcome to try. Consider that the albumin that is coming out of the purge is not terribly dissimilar to gently cooked egg white. It's not remotely the same as what drips off a roast... it's not fatty... I encourage the experiment, though.
      • Lowjiber
        Former Member
        • Nov 2016
        • 315
        • Las Vegas, Nevada

        #14
        Thanks a zillion-times for this piece, Potkettleblack. I'm just putting my toe in the SV waters, and you've finally revealed how to handle the purge. Being an old hillbilly cook, I just tried to use as I would the juice from a conventionally cooked roast and quickly discovered that I was somehow making a huge mistake.

        This should be "required reading" for anyone venturing into SV cooking.

        Comment


        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          Thank you. Please pay it forward.
      • MBMorgan
        Club Member
        • Sep 2015
        • 5590
        • Colorado
        • > Weber Genesis EP-330
          > Grilla Grills Original Grilla (OG) pellet smoker
          > Pit Barrel Cooker (gone to a new home)
          > WeberQ 2000 (on "loan" to a relative)
          > Old Smokey Electric (for chickens mostly - when it's too nasty out
          to fiddle with a more capable cooker)
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          > BBQ Guru Rib Ring

          > Favorite Beer: Guinness Extra Stout, Fat Tire, Anchor Steam, or Alaskan Amber
          > Favorite Wine: Klinker Brick Old Ghost Zinfandel or Matetic Corralillo Winemaker's Blend
          > Favorite Whiskey: Balvenie Double Wood Scotch or Jameson Irish

        #15
        Great info, Potkettleblack ... thanks!

        Comment

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