Help! Is this food safe?

[MadUncleAndy]

I was doing a long cook last night when my Fireboard 2 Drive failed. More on that later, but right now I just want to see whether the 17 lbs of food is safe or garbage. Here is the cook up until the point it failed. https://share.fireboard.io/0C505C. This was at 5:22 am with final readings with the meat in the mid 170s internal, top rack c. 220, and bottom rack c. 200. (WSM)

I woke up and saw "waiting for data" so went down to the pit and was able to restart the Fireboard for a bit. Here's what I have: https://share.fireboard.io/2AF6D2 Meat internals 146 and 154. Racks c. 125 at 08:24. I've added fresh coals, and put in my trusty old Therm Pro...it has fewer whistles and bells but at least doesn't freeze up on me, Pits are now back c. 203. One pork butt briefly went to 138 internal, but is now back to 140.

Is this meat safe at this point, or should I toss it. It looks like about 3 hours between data points, with some of that time having the meat exterior below 140, but I don't know how long, other than < 3 hours, so I'm hoping okay? I just want to run it by you folks.

As for the fireboard....what happened at 5:22 is it apparently ran out of battery, despite being plugged in to their backup battery. I unplugged and re-plugged the USB C side of the power cable (on the FB) and that brought it back, so the backup battery had not run out of power. It shows 3 dots out of 4 for charge. I restarted the drive program, added coals, and then tried to take the drive to manual to get around the lid open shutting down the fan. At that point it lost all connection to the outside world. It says it's on my wifi, but it's not sending data or connecting to the app or desktop UIs. I've tried rebooting it, and while it says "powering down" never does. The screen still works if I want to stand outside and watch it with Mk 1 eyeball, but that's not really what I had in mind when I bought an expensive cloud connected thermometer. I've considered factory reset, but I don't know if there's some way Fireboard can get useful debugging data out of it on their end, so am reluctant to do it.

Meanwhile back to manual vent controls and my el-cheapo therm-pro.

Thanks in advance for any advice!!!

[hoovarmin]

I'll defer to the food scientists here for a detailed answer but there's no way in hell I'd throw that meat out.

[Donw]

I believe you are safe, especially as you are bringing the food quickly back into the safe zone. I base this on a report from the USDA debating the actual minimum safe time and temperature.
”For non-continuous temperature and time monitoring, a minimum hot holding temperature of 130 degrees Fahrenheit for a maximum time of 4 hours, based on information provided by FDA regarding the limitation of growth of Clostridium perfringens to no more than 1 log₁₀ in food ^[2], would be adequate to ensure food safety. In addition, the Committee concluded that a minimum temperature of 135 degrees for a maximum of 8 hours, or a minimum temperature of 140 degrees Fahrenheit indefinitely also would be adequate to ensure food
safety. Finally, the Committee concluded that any food that requires temperature and time control for safety that is maintained during hot holding at a lower temperature or for a longer time than recommended by the Committee is unsafe for purposes of food service and retail establishment use.”

[grantgallagher]

When it comes to food safety MadUncleAndy trust Donw

[smokin fool]

The most learned on this site say, when in doubt throw it out!!!!
As hoovarmin says throwing out 17lbs of meat is a tough pill to swallow.
I'd finish the cook and go from there.
The smart ones should be up soon, they'll know the answer.

[MadUncleAndy]

Thans gents!!!

Meanwhile, I've found the "Hard Reset" for Fireboard. It's documented on their site, but not in the manual that comes with the device. Go figure. Hold a button down for c.20-30 seconds. That seems to have resurrected it.

I still need to talk with their customer service. Why did the battery pack not keep the bloody thing charged? Also, it totally floors me that I got no alert on my app when it lost connectivity to the thermometer for c. 3 hours. I've been in the software engineering biz since Reagan was president. I know all about bugs...bugs happen...but lack of a basic failsafe feature like that floors me. Or maybe there is one and it's also just poorly documented rather than being a default.

Anyway, food looks and smells great now, so I really hope it's salvageable; it's not just that it's $50 bucks and 21 hours of cooking time any more! :P https://share.fireboard.io/73790A

[fzxdoc]

I agree with Donw . From all that I've read about food safety, you're well within the safe zone. However, that backup battery may be DOA by the time you're done with it.

FWIW, I always, always plug in my Fireboard. I never trust the battery, especially for the times when the cook might be unattended for a while.

Kathryn

[Ann-Marie in the backyard]

Big ugly orange outdoors extension cords FTW.

[Dewesq55]

That's the main reason I put electrical outlets on my deck - to plug in my Fireboard and my rotisserie motor - with "big ugly orange outdoors extension cords." 😁

[Ann-Marie in the backyard]

Someday -- SOMEDAY -- we'll get around to actually putting in a patio, and it'll include an open shelter wired for electrical outlets. Until that day, however, BUOOEC will have to do.

[Dewesq55]

I have always loved my Fireboard and generally can't say enough good things about it. That said, I have had my issues. My original Drive cable failed after about 2 years of moderate use. Not only didn't it work, it would shut the FB down when I plugged it into the device. Their only solution was to sell me a refurbished replacement at a discounted price. Then, within the last year, the Fireboard itself started freezing and/or loosing connection during even a moderate length cook. The solution has always been to reboot the device, which is a PITA. I wrote customer service and they suggestion was if I send it back to them they will check it out to see what might be wrong. Since I personally attribute these issues to the fact that I abused the device over time, including getting it too close to the firebox of my smoker which melted/deformed the case pretty severely and later I left it outside overnight to get rained on, so I just sucked it up and bought a FB2. I haven't used the 2 yet since my cookers have been mothballed during my deck build. If I remember correctly, Paul Adare - pkadare had an issue with his brand new FB2 Drive whereby it completely froze up when he tried to use it. I'm not sure whatever became of the issue but I've seen him post positive things about his FB2 since then. Sorry it happened to you.

[bbqLuv]

https://amazingribs.com/technique-and-science/more-cooking-science/safe-serving-temperatures

this will help.
I go by If in doubt, through it out.

[Dewesq55]

Ann-Marie in the backyard -

Kim

[Ann-Marie in the backyard]

Oh now how clever is that! And is that a water spigot next to the post? I'll save this picture and idea for our patio-to-be. The BUOOEC has a place, but doesn't have to live out there.

[Dewesq55]

Ann-Marie in the backyard - Yes, it's a water spigot. I plan to attach a hose, mostly in case of fire, but it can be used for other things as well, obviously. I love those recessed outlet boxes. I didn't know they existed until I saw one while looking for outdoor junction boxes at Lowes. I have 3 of them installed in the corners. The corner closest to where the camera is positioned is by the door and there is a wall outlet right inside, so a 4th box wasn't necessary.

[Dewesq55]

Ann-Marie in the backyard - I agree the BUOOEC doesn't have to live out there. The one in the photo is powering my miter saw while I finish the build project.

[MadUncleAndy]

Thank you all for your input! Pork was delicious. No adverse effects thus far anyway, and it was more moist than I'd feared given the extra hours. For what it's worth, after two requests to Fireboard, have not been contacted by their customer service. Before this weekend I would have heartily recommended them to anyone. After this weekend, not so much. I will be issuing warnings on their bad code + bad customer service.

[Huskee]

Interesting. Glad you were able to salvage the cook! This is the first negative thing I've read about FB's CS. I hope you hear from them soon and they take care of you.

[MadUncleAndy]

So, an update regarding the Fireboard issue. Meathead generously offered to bring my plight to Fireboard's attention. Whether it was at Meathea'ds behest, or just happy coincidence, Todd from Fireboard saw my post elsewhere, and gave me a contact email.

Once I emailed, , that got grouped with some emails back from them that must have been in my spam bin, so total egg on my face there. They replied. I didn't get those replies.

On the downside, it's not just that I couldn't find a feature to alarm my phone app if it lost contact to a live cook...that feature doesn't exist yet, although I got encouraging feedback that it may be on their to-do list.

Also, I've been in the software biz for c. 35 years, and poking around their docs, I see they have an "API"...that is a neat way for developers to write custom code to connect to Fireboard's cloud. Based solely on reading the docs, not experimentation, it may be easy to roll your own alarm software if you're inclined to do so. I've never written in Java, and the last code I wrote for any embedded device was during the Clinton administration,...further, I'm old and cranky, and my giveahoot is busted about half the time, but I spend more time in meetings than coding these days and kind of miss it, so I may or may not give it a crack. If not, someone younger/faster/smarter than me may get to it first, and God bless them if the do. If/when I do get something worth releasing, Fireboard in agreement, I'll release it as "charity-ware"....if you like it, donate to the charity of our choice. Free otherwise.

[rickgregory]

Huh. It's a simple REST API. Don't need java, you could do this as a web service. But if you did this as an app for iOS and android there's likely more work in designing the app etc than getting the info. Could do it as a service that sends people a text but then... that's not an alarm.

https://docs.fireboard.io/app/api.html for any of the other coders out there that might want to play.

[MadUncleAndy]

Yeah, but I want to run it on my Android phone, and having just downloaded their SDK, it looks Java centric. It looks like a simple shell script with some curl would do, if only I'd be willing to sleep next to my linux box. Been meaning to try my hand at Java for some time. This may be the way to do it on my own terms/schedule.

[rickgregory]

MadUncleAndy And thats why I wouldn't bother. You want an alarm which means a native app. But then you have to mess with parameters for the alarm - you don't want to alarm if it dips 1 degree below your set temp or even 20 degrees but for a few minutes because you opened the lid. You really want to alarm if and only if the cook is actually failing. So you design a UI for that... 'tell me if it's more than X below my set temp of Y for M minutes" etc etc etc.

Or they can add this to their app which they really should since, well, I don't to tell you why

[MadUncleAndy]

Oh heck, I was just thinking, of polling every x minutes and alerting after y polls with no new data. Their app is amazing otherwise.

It just has that miss on a fail safe for "if your device gets trampled by a herd of mad yaks or something." ...or runs out of battery at 0520.

I'd want to run both concurrently. My option otherwise is run my old them pro in parallel,...it has a low temperature alarm, and also the "ET hasn't phoned home" contingency covered, but otherwise is mediocre.

​​​​​​​That said, yeah, my ideal would be for Fireboard to add it to *their* client...and hopefully that's in the pipe, but until I can scratch a window with it, it's vaporware.

[rickgregory]

"Oh heck, I was just thinking, of polling every x minutes and alerting after y polls with no new data. "

Yeah, that's what I'd do for personal use.

[Joetee]

I'm awful about throwing away food. If it looks good, smells good, tastes good, I'll eat it's. Never been sick yet. My wife says I have a cast iron stomach. I may get a little loose in the stool, but that's fine with me. I probably need a clean out anyway.

Besides, when you finish cooking your meat, the temp is high enough to kill off any bacteria.