Going to sous vide a whole, vacuum wrapped packer brisket. Fully thawed. From fridge to sous vide. Temp on sous vide, 165°F?
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Sous vide to reheat a packer brisket
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I did a full brisket sous vide a couple of months ago. I turned out fine BUT if I do it again I would just sous vide the flat and smoke the point the traditional way.
Someone in the pit posted this and I used it to cook my brisket. Sorry I don’t know who it was.
“ When I do a QVQ brisket it turns out really well, tender and juicy, with the plus being a rare finish. Typically I smoke to an internal of around 115*, then go into the bath for around 50 hours at 130*. After an ice bath I give it a kiss of smoke to firm the bark and get whatever additional smoke flavor I can get as well. The trick, at least in my opinion is to never overshoot your bath temp. The meat tends to tighten up if you do overshoot, perhaps that may be what you inadvertently did with your post smoke. I really don't think it was the choice versus prime, I've done both without a whole lot of difference, unless of course you just got a bad one.
How long does that second "kiss of smoke" last?
I don't really concentrate on temp, actually hold around 275*, it's really a function of internal temperature, I try to hold to no more then low 130ish. Whatever extra bark I get is a bonus.â€
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Originally posted by Santamarina View PostSV seems like a great way to reheat!
Refer to this topic:
https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...nd-food-safety
Pay particular attention to Potkettleblack 's post on that topic here:
https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...872#post540872
and to Polarbear777 's excellent summation here:
https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...101#post541101
The take home message is that the safest way to reheat anything is to bring it from fridge to eating temp as quickly as possible, so using a sous vide bath for reheating may not be a good option.
KathrynLast edited by fzxdoc; December 15, 2018, 07:41 AM.
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It’s time for the AmazingRibs food safety experts to weigh in!
I took a whole packer brisket that was cooled in the refrigerator, vacuum sealed, and then frozen after my last cook. After a month, I thawed it in the refrigerator. Did sous vide in original vacuum sealed pack at 165°F for 4.5 hours. Cooked at 400°F in the oven for 30 minutes to dry the bark. Center temp with Thermapen was 165° when it was pulled from the oven. Looked good. Great smoke flavor. Texture like a fresh pulled brisket. Is the meat pasteurized by this process and safe to eat? Is there a food safety issue in taking some portion of the 4 hour sous vide time period to go from refrigerator temp to 165°F, or is it pasteurized by having a center temp of 165°F? As I understand it, this should be safe to eat.Last edited by Dr._Pat; December 15, 2018, 09:57 AM.
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Can't say I'm a safety expert, but have done a fair amount of SVQ. Assuming you did a full cook before putting that in the freezer (whether in a pit or SV), I'd be comfortable with your process here. Once cooked, sealed and frozen, there's little need to re-pasteurize. IMO.
Jerod Broussard is your man.
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My toys:
Weber Summit Charcoal Grilling Center (WSCGC) aka Mr. Fancypants
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Weber Kettle Premium 22" named Kettle Kid, eager to horn in with more cooks in the future
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Grill Grates: six 19.25 panels for exact fit for Summit S650
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Steelmade Griddle for Summit gas grill
Fireboard Gear:Extreme BBQ Thermometer PackagePit Viper Fan (to pair with Fireboard Fan Driver Cable)
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Additional probes: Competition Probes 1" (3) and 4" (1), 3 additional Ambient Probes. 1 additional Food Probe
2 Driver Cables
Pit Viper Fan new design (to pair with Fireboard Fan Driver Cable)
Thermoworks Gear:Thermapen MK4 (pink)Maverick ET 73 a little workhorse with limited range
Thermapen Classic (pink too)
Thermoworks MK4 orange
Temp Test 2 Smart Thermometer
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Maverick ET 733
Maverick (Ivation) ET 732
Grill Pinz
Vortex (two of them)
18" drip pan for WSCGC
Ceramic Spacers for WSCGC in Kamado Mode: 2 sets each 1/2", 1", 2". The 2" spacers work best with the 18" drip pan. The 1+1/2 inch spacers work best with the 14 inch cake pan.
Two Joule Sous Vide devices
3 Lipavi Sous Vide Tubs with Lids: 12, 18 and 26 quarts
Avid Armor Ultra Pro V32 Chamber Sealer
Instant Pot 6 Quart Electric Pressure Cooker
Instant Pot 10 Quart Electric Pressure Cooker
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A-Maze-N tube 12 inch tube smoker accessory for use with pellets
BBQ Dragon and Dragon Chimney
Shun Classic Series:8" Chef Knife
6" Chef's Knife
Gokujo Boning and Fillet Knife
3 1/2 inch Paring Knife
I'm no safety expert either, but as I understand it, it's the 40 to 140°F window for food that is of safety concern, added to the fact that the time food spends in the unsafe zone is cumulative, according to the expert that Potkettleblack cited on that other topic.
That is, the food already ramped up through the unsafe zone until it reached its target temp in the bath, stayed there long enough to be pasturized (although the spores are not killed but are, instead, activated), and then ramped down through the unsafe zone during the cooldown. With reheating, you're bringing it back up through the unsafe zone again, and are not (possibly) heating it long enough to be repasturized, if that is a goal, but just to come up to a target temp.
The rule of thumb, again, as I understand it, is that food should not be between 40 and 140° for more than a total of 4 hours.
So, theoretically speaking, if a hunk of meat takes, say, 5 hours to reach 165° in the rewarming sous vide step, it could be possible that about 4 hours were spent going through the unsafe zone while rewarming. In that scenario, rewarming would use up all the safe time in the danger zone allotted by the FDA. Add to that the unsafe zone times spent in chilling down the pasturized meat, and one could be, again theoretically, over the food safety limit of time spent in the 40-140° range.
Of course pasturization occurs during sous vide, so of concern are 1. the spores that are not killed by pasturization, and 2. the possible re-introduction of bacteria in the handling of the cooked meat between sous vide cooldown and the rewarming process.
I think there is a consensus of thought here that if the food remains vacuum sealed from sous vide through rewarming, the risk from re-introducing bacteria is negligible, so rewarming for a long period of time may not pose a food safety risk. I'm still researching this and would appreciate any specific references.
I hope folks who know much more about this than I will chime in and let me know if my understanding is accurate.
Thanks,
KathrynLast edited by fzxdoc; December 15, 2018, 11:40 AM.
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Originally posted by Dr._Pat View Post
I took a whole packer brisket that was cooled in the refrigerator...
I think its probably safe to eat, but I wouldn’t feed it to folks at work or friends.
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Cooked to 201°F. Rested in electric Cambro at 155° for hours, then into the refrigerator. Cooled overnight, then unwrapped from paper and put into vacuum bag (wearing gloves), vacuum sealed, then into the freezer. This is a fully cooked, pasteurized piece of meat. Pulled from freezer, thawed in refrigerator. From refrigerator into 165° bath until center temp is 165°. Into 400° oven for 30 minutes. Thermapen verifies center temp of 165°. While I am all about food safety, I can see no reason why having a piece of meat at 165° for 30 to 60 minutes is not safe. The time it took to get to 165° should not be an issue. I ran it by the Meat Sciences folks at Texas A&M. They found no safety issues with this process.
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Putting a large piece of hot meat in the fridge with other cold items is a bad idea. Total time in the zone is a factor as well. Once through slow on the way to 200*, once down slow in the fridge, once back through slow in the bath.
As we used to say at UT, I would have gone to A&M, but I’d already graduated high school. ;-)
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