Welcome!


This is a membership forum. As a guest, you can click around a bit. View 5 pages for free. If you would like to participate, please join.

[ Pitmaster Club Information | Join Now | Login | Contact Us ]

There are 4 page views remaining.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Cold Grill Technique

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Cold Grill Technique

    So I'm having this discussion on the SNSGrills FB page and I thought I'd ask here as well. I really don't get the point. I totally get that this "technique" means that you don't get grill marks on what you're searing but really, what's the point. I am as much of a fan as anyone of centre to edge being done the same, but really, do grill marks ruin that experience for anyone? Do the lack of grill marks, in any way, make my steak taste or present better? I'm willing to be convinced here but really, I just don't see the point.

    What, if anything, am I missing?

    #2
    What I noticed is the meat tends to stick less using the cold grate technique. After the first or second pass, I don’t spin anymore. If I put the steak on a hot grill, even with oil, it can stick a little.

    Comment


    • RonB
      RonB commented
      Editing a comment
      ^^ This! ^^ I also stop rotating the grate when the protein starts to get a little brown on it.

    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      So from cooking in CI, if the meat sticks, it isn't ready to be flipped yet. Still not convincing me that the cold grate is worthwhile.

    #3
    I think it's a waste of effort and unnecessary.

    Comment


    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      Thanks! My feeling as well, though as with everything I keep an open mind. Someone on the FB group thinks otherwise. :-)

    • Steve R.
      Steve R. commented
      Editing a comment
      Agree. I really don't see an advantage in doing that.

    • Henrik
      Henrik commented
      Editing a comment
      I agree on this too.

    #4
    So the answer I get on the FB page is one of:
    • Just try it.
    • You've obviously got your mind made up and you should leave.
    Not terribly helpful but par for the course for the internet.

    Comment


    • ScottyC13
      ScottyC13 commented
      Editing a comment
      If can rotate your current grate, try it. You are a good enough cook to determine if it’s worth it for you.

    • tbob4
      tbob4 commented
      Editing a comment
      Gotta love the "you aren't listening so leave" remark! I am in the minority in that I like grill marks. I have a Santa Maria grill and have the fire tapered. When cooking a steak, I do a front seer, then I move the steak to a lower temp area of the grill, cover with a pan, and finish either on the grill side or the griddle side of the GrillGrates. If I finish on the flat side, I don't get the grill marks. Just because of the question, I am doing a steak tonight - shooting for grill marks.

    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      ScottyC13 - I can certainly do it, my question still stands though. What's the point?

    #5
    https://amazingribs.com/more-techniq...hould-not-flip
    Just another way. More of a preference thing though. I like the cold grate technique because I tend to go overboard seering and have no patience so I mess up the cross hatch look anyway.
    Last edited by Michael Brinton; February 10, 2020, 06:21 PM.

    Comment


    • Michael Brinton
      Michael Brinton commented
      Editing a comment
      How about to make it look pan seared and throw people when they ask how the steak was finished? 😁 I don't think you'll find demonstrable proof it's "better". They sell a stainless steel hinged grate that you can spin around the grill. It does what it's supposed to do.

    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      Sorry, still seems to be a waste of money and time to me. I'm still not convinced. And if I really wanted it to look pan seared, I throw on one of my CI skillets on the grill and sear it that way. Still not seeing a compelling reason for this "technique". I am willing to be convinced I'm wrong, still haven't read anything that will convince me and I'm apparently not alone.

    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      Following on the pan seared thought, that would be truly horrible since not only is the steak touching just a few screaming hot grill points, it is now completely touching a screaming hot CI skillet, so even worse than just a few grill lines. :-)

    #6
    I think the goal is that you get a more even Maillard effect over the meat's surface with the cold grate technique.

    From the Adrenaline BBQ website: The perfect sear using the Cold Grate Technique

    Everyone agrees: grill marks = flavor. The brown crust that forms due to the exposure of meat to high heat (Maillard reaction) produces the most flavorful bites. So why are we happy with food that only has strips of flavor? What if we could have all-over flavor? We can! The Slow ‘N Sear and the Cold Grate Technique make it both possible and incredibly easy.


    Kathryn

    Comment


    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      So this seems to be saying that the grates themselves rob the rest of the cooking area of the heat that would otherwise go to the meat that is in between the grates. That is not how heat works.
      Also, that is just marketing speak, there is no science behind those words. "Hey, this does this and we can do this!". Ok, how do you do this, and how is it better than that?
      Last edited by pkadare; February 10, 2020, 06:51 PM.

    #7
    pkadare , in regards to your 6.1 post. I think it is actually the opposite of what you are saying. The grates don’t rob heat but instead concentrate it. Heat works in different ways as there are different kinds of heat. So in an oven if I put the broiler on and raise the rack close to it and put a steak under it the it will start to sear it without actually touching the steak... however if I lifted the steaks and put them on the burner it would start to char where the steak is touching... to the extent you end up burning the where it is touching before searing the rest and creating an “all over crust” so to speak....

    So my understanding is with cold grate instead of the heat being concentrated more at the grate it is more balanced and even heating... kind of like the opposite approach of a griddle surface where the entire surface side of a steak is touching an evenly hot surface... in both cases it is trying to even out the heat without concentrating it in any one place.... if that makes sense...

    Meathead has said in one of his articles in heat and explaining the difference... something to the effect of “you can hold your hand in a 500 degree oven for 2 minutes and probably be ok... touch the grated inside of a 500 degree oven for 2 minutes and when you get back from the hospital you can explain the difference in how heat works to us”.

    then again I could be wrong... to each their own and go with what works for you...

    maybe David Parrish will stop in sometime and better explain.

    Comment


    • shify
      shify commented
      Editing a comment
      pkadare - I think the thought process is basically the direct heat of the grill marks will burn the steak before it is fully cooked, so you end up with bitter, burnt tasting grill marks and non-browned spots in between (no different if you tried to cook a steak with a blowtorch held in one spot). So the cold grate is then a gentler way to cook it and but cooking it lower it dries out the surface which then helps with the Maillard reaction to brown the entire steak.
      Last edited by shify; February 10, 2020, 08:37 PM.

    • pkadare
      pkadare commented
      Editing a comment
      shify - the blow torch in a single spot isn't a fair comparison because when the steak is on a grill, yes, it is getting more cooking from where it touches the grill, but it is still getting cooked through the openings between the grill lines. So again, yes, I get that the grill marks may be less than ideal but not enough to affect the way my steak tastes or how much it is cooked. Still not convinced.

    • tbob4
      tbob4 commented
      Editing a comment
      Based on your question I did an experiment tonight. I cooked a ribeye on my GrillGrates. I browned one side on the flat side and the other on the grill side. It does not exactly replicate the cold grate method. The steak was delicious. The only difference, and I would have to try MANY times with different factors (which side first, time, baste material etc) but I found that the side with grill marks did not band down as far as the flat side - but the banding was minimal.

    #8
    I've done and it made an awesome steak. Most times I don't do it (I prefer front sear) and I still get awesome steak. I think it's akin to swirling and smelling your wine first. Those that do it think it helps, those that don't find it pointless, both enjoy their wine the same and think the other is wrong. I say "you do you"!

    Comment


    • tbob4
      tbob4 commented
      Editing a comment
      Awesome answer. I would never begrudge someone who has found "their" perfect method and I sense the frustration from pkadare comes from folks on another forum telling him that his preference is wrong.

    • Huskee
      Huskee commented
      Editing a comment
      tbob4 Yup. Gotta love the folks that want to tell a person their preference is wrong. No one really cares about your sneakers, your pizza toppings, your shirt color, those are generally accepted as a 'who cares' thing. But trucks, BBQ, cookers, politics, those things are for some reason a 'my way is right and you're wrong' thing. It gets so old.

    • tbob4
      tbob4 commented
      Editing a comment
      Huskee - I just bought my first pair of Brooks sneakers last week. Best shoes of all time. HA. Walking to the grill is so much softer. I just don't know why I'm not running faster or jumping higher.

    #9
    I like the no grate technique. I put skewers through the side/edges of the steak so I can lay it across a screaming hot lit chimney.

    Main problem with grill marks is that you either get tasty brown grill marks with no brown/malliard in between or if waiting for the browning in between, the grill marks get black. Conduction heat transfer from the bars is much faster than from the hot air.

    of course you can move the steak around a lot and accomplish a more even browning. Or use cold grate spin or use flat grill grates or use a CI pan. As long as most of the steak surface is brown but not black, you win, no matter how you got it to work.

    Comment


    • scottranda
      scottranda commented
      Editing a comment
      NO GRATE TECHNIQUE!! That’s my jam!! I like some seasoning to give it that crunch/crust. Char crust garlic peppercorn is my fave!

    #10
    Originally posted by Polarbear777 View Post
    you win, no matter how you got it to work.
    Yup ...

    Comment


      #11
      I've done it and didn't experience a benefit. Just more work in my opinion.

      Comment


        #12
        pkadare in regards to your responses in 7.1 , 7.2, etc... I don't think the arguement is that grill marks make a steak worse... maybe the better argument for some folks is that grill marks don't optimize the steak. Even Meathead argues this when it comes to grill marks... So your logic seems to be that any method that limits grill marks and promotes a consistent even sear is a waste... Cold Grate is just another method of trying to get the even sear through a different form of heat. The goal isn't to eliminate grill marks... the goal is to make the outside of the steak one giant grill mark...

        David presented this method to the pit back around the time when he was the PitBoss for the pitmaster's club... some of us were around when the SnS came out and some of these things, techniques, etc... started to get talked about, presented, etc... that was a few years and beers ago so trying to remember all the conversation around it is more than I want to try to do tonight.... however I did a quick search and some of the stuff may have went through the slaughterhouse and may not be out there but I found a couple of things....

        Here are a couple of posts he had in here back in the day when SnS was just picking up steam. He explains the rationale more in the videos.

        https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...-demonstration

        https://pitmaster.amazingribs.com/fo...h-a-cold-grate

        Some people are going to profess this technique completely out of loyalty to Dave and/or SnS (same as some people will profess something of MH's for the same reason and will fight to the BBQ death over it), some folks have tried it and it is the technique that works best for them and gives them the best consistent results, some folks tried it and didn't like it, some folks think grill marks are still the hallmark of a great steak....

        As far as it not being worth the effort or making enough of a difference... again it is all personal preference and opinion... a lot of people feel the same way about SV and no matter what you will never convince them it is worth it... and that is cool... people need to do what they like... if someone prefers fall off the bone ribs as opposed to competition style... it doesn't mean they are wrong or that the other way is better... it is what is right for them because it is what they like.
        Last edited by Nate; February 10, 2020, 10:20 PM.

        Comment


        • Huskee
          Huskee commented
          Editing a comment
          VERY well said! I agree 110% with all the above.

        • patcrail
          patcrail commented
          Editing a comment
          Nate , well spoken, & thought out! I think you’ve nailed it. My PERSONAL preference is all-over searing, however you choose to do it. I don’t care a whit about marks either way, & so far, I’ve used the “afterburner technique” the most, just got my SNS today, so who knows?
          ... bottom line, there ain’t no right or wrong in BBQ, as long as you like the results & the way you get them, more power to you!
          I’d rather argue about important stuff: over easy or sunny side up?

        #13
        Well said, Nate. There is no rght or wrong answer here. At the end of the day, no matter which way you go, you're eating steak. #firstworldproblems

        Comment


        • Loren
          Loren commented
          Editing a comment
          I do believe you have hit the nail on the head! 😎

        #14
        Opinions are like a***holes; everyone has one. The issue is too many people are acting like their opinions.

        Regardless of the cold grate method, the spinning grate is an interesting item. I have tried to spin the grate on my 22.5" Master-touch with one hand and have nearly pulled the grill over. It's a 2 hand grate. There are times when that ability would be nice. The hinged portion that is removable is also a grate idea (pun intended). I would have purchased it long ago but have had to stop because of a lack of storage space with the stuff I already have. Once I fix that, MCS will be able to be let out for a breath of fresh air.

        Comment


          #15
          tbob4 nailed it earlier, ya gotta have grill marks....that is my preference when doing steak.
          Would I turn my nose up at Cold Grill steak, heck no.
          @ JimLinebarger comment about opinions are like....pretty much sums up FB and the reason I don't bother with it at all.

          Comment

          Announcement

          Collapse
          No announcement yet.
          Working...
          X
          false
          0
          Guest
          500
          ["pitmaster-my-membership","login","join-pitmaster","lostpw","reset-password","special-offers","help","nojs","meat-ups","gifts","authaau-alpha","ebooklogin-start","alpha","start"]
          false
          false
          {"count":0,"link":"/forum/announcements/","debug":""}
          Yes
          Rubs Promo
          Meat-Up in Memphis