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Considering pellet grill purchase, YS640 versus ...

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    Considering pellet grill purchase, YS640 versus ...

    Longtime reader of Amazingribs.com and Meathead fan, I am considering adding a pellet grill to my outdoor cooker lineup. I currently have a Weber 22" with SnS as my main outdoor cooker, and I also have a BGE Mini. I have had a large big green egg in the past, but sold it when I sold my last house and replaced it with the 22" Kettle + SnS for easier 2 zone cooking. I have also had various gas grills in the past (Weber Genesis, a Tec and most recently a Solaire infra red, also sold when I moved as it was built in), but I don't have a gasser now and am not really considering one. I also have a Joule Sous Vide circulator, I mention this as I use it quite a bit for super ease of cooking larger hunks of meat, i.e. if I'm doing a prime rib or something it's usually done sous vide - I definitely do not "need" another cooker, it's just something I am considering.

    So would fill the following roles:

    1) Would partially replace the role a gas grill has played in the past - weeknights for burgers and stuff when I'm too lazy to start a fire (I have an almost 1 year old son, he takes a lot of the time and attention after work that used to go towards tinkering with a big green egg). Reverse sear ability is a big plus. I realize none of these will sear as well as directly over the SnS, but reverse sear ability about on par with a decent gasser (Weber Genesis) would be nice.

    2) Smoker for longer low n slow cooks. I don't love super strong smoke flavor and my wife likes it less than I do, so I don't really see the more subtle smoke flavor knock in many reviews of pellet cookers as a negative.

    3) Would like the added capacity when entertaining. The 22" kettle has plenty of room for cooking for my family, but there are times when hosting people over where I think the capacity of something like the YS640 would be nice to have. This could be either as a smoker or for burgers, so again the versatility of either low n slow smoke roasting or reverse sear, or both on the same day, would be nice.


    The front runner I am considering is the Yoder YS640, based on the reviews I've read here and elsewhere it seems like it would fit what I want fairly well. It's a little large for my space but I think it would fit ok. I'm not really considering the smaller YS480 as they are almost the same price, and I do think the larger capacity would be nice to have esp when setting it up for reverse sear where the 480 might feel kind of small.

    A few questions I have on the YS640:

    1) It seems the biggest knock on them is they are "pellet hogs". I have encountered some comments online arguing Yoder did it all wrong and the thick steel is a poor design for a pellet smoker as it just adds mass that needs to be heated. Comments on this, from people who have owned them? Is this issue overblown? I have never given the cost of propane or charcoal a second thought, is pellet consumption a similar magnitude cost wise?

    2) I live in FL - is rust an issue? Will be stored under a covered patio. One person in one thread here inferred there have been a lot of rust issues with the Yoder, but they didn't link any sources for this and I have not come across much mention of rust issues in my searches aside from that one comment.

    3) Are the wheels on the standard version sufficient to wheel around the patio? I would like to avoid the added cost of the comp cart if possible. Again, this will be stored under covered patio pushed up against the wall, I imagine I will want to roll it out from under the cover when using so smoke can escape. My patio is all pavers, so it's not like I would be rolling it over grass or dirt or anything, but it would be getting wheeled maybe 10-15 ft most times it is used.

    4) How well does the YS640 work for reverse sear with the grill grates and trap door setup? How long does it take to go from say 250 for indirect to searing temp? I imagine if doing something like burgers, I could start the cook w/ grill grates already on and trap door open to avoid having to change the layout when it's hot.

    5) Does anyone have the dimensions with side shelf removed? Website says width is 61" with the side shelf, I think removing it could resolve the concern I have of it taking up too much space (it will physically fit either way, it's just a matter of how much real estate I want to give up).



    As I said, YS640 is clearly the front runner but I am willing to consider other options, some others worth mentioning:

    Pitts and Spitts 850 - I really like the look of these, I think it would be less of an eyesore on my patio than the Yoder. Not sure if it would reverse sear as well though, and there is less information/reviews on them in general. Similar heavy construction to the Yoder, which is either good or bad depending on who's opinion I am reading.

    Rec Tec - Great value, may be a good option if concerns about the Yoder being a "pellet hog" are valid. I don't like the looks of it that much though, it definitely looks more cheaply made than the Yoder. How is it for reverse sear?

    Most of the others on the market don't seem as well suited to reverse sear as the Yoder. The Maks get great reviews, I think the 1 star is a little small for what I want and the 2 star is a different class price wise



    Two of the biggest things that are keeping me from puling the trigger are, the Yoder is big and it's expensive (again, I physically have room for it but am trying to keep my patio something resembling uncluttered). OTOH, if I was going the gasser route I don't think I would think twice about getting a Weber Genesis II or even a Summit, either of which would be just as big and similarly expensive as the YS640.
    Last edited by Walt Dockery; June 20, 2018, 09:40 AM.

    #2
    Yoder isn't a pellet hog! And the rust issues are prior to the new paint room at the plant. I'm taking my Cimarron back to the factory in August for a "refresh" paint on the black parts.

    I too love the looks of the Pitts and Spitts -- if the 850 refers to the cooking space, it's some bigger than the Yoder 640. Both of these are made in USA.

    If made in China isn't a concern, look at the Grilla Silverbac. While I am a big Grilla fan, I've been looking at the measurements of a Silverbac for another MCS purpose! Looks like the cooking grate is about 26" x 16" and the price is definitely right.

    My opinion is there really are no bad pellet grills, just some that are starter models, some Fords and for the Cadillac, buy a MAK!

    Comment


    • Nate
      Nate commented
      Editing a comment
      Listen to this lady.… She peddles pellets for a living and knows her pellet cookers!!!!

    #3
    I will preface by saying I don't own either but have found a few things while doing a lot of research right now because I'm pulling the trigger on a pellet cooker as well soon.

    The main cookers in that price point range in addition to Yoder I was interested in were:

    1. Blaz'n Grill - Grid Iron... I really like this because of the double wall insulation which I think may be better than just the use of thick steel like the Yoder. They have an awesome burn pot cleanout feature. They also have a nice pro shelf option for more real estate... in addition to all the other features... There are some folks in the pit that have them and can hopefully chime in.

    2. MAK - great reputation
    3. Pitts and Spits... love the stainless and roll up hood design.

    In the end my two options have really come down to Blaz'n and Grilla Silverbac (double wall construction)….. Right now I like the impact that Grilla will have on my wallet better than the Blaz'n…. but if price weren't an issue.... then I may go a different way....

    Let us know what you decide... i'm quite sure there will be a number of folks jumping in....

    Comment


      #4
      Both Nate and CandySueQ have a point about the Grilla Silverbac having a major positive impact on your wallet - you can about get 2 of those for the price of 1 Yoder. Yoder is great of course, but you WILL want the 2 part diffuser from what I read, and that bumps the cost up around $1600 or so, plus shipping.

      I read a lot of good things about Grilla in general, and with the upper shelf extension, the Silverbac has a pretty high smoking capacity. I cannot comment to searing. A buddy of mine recently sold his Kamado Joe for $500 after buying a Camp Chef Wood Wind, which has a 900F+ gas sear box on the side of a pellet grill, as he can both smoke and do some serious searing on it, and realized he would never use his Kamado again.

      Comment


      • Nate
        Nate commented
        Editing a comment
        That searing box is an AWESOME concept! They just owned that pellets don't sear as well and instead of doing something where you had to move, replace grates, etc... to be able to sear they just said, "here this is easier".... if they were a little sturdier and had a comp cart option I would be looking hard at them....

      #5
      I own a Pitts & Spitts and would highly recommend it. The Yoder YS640 was really my first choice but given that I live in Houston where the P&S pits are made, saving the $850 delivery fee that Yoder wanted is what swung me. That being said I'd like to comment on some of your concerns;

      As to the fact that thicker pit wall thickness is going to cause increased pellet usage is nonsense in my opinion. Like any good stick burner there is a warm up period where the cooker has to come up to temp but once there it takes a long time to cool down. The net result is actually less fuel usage over all PLUS you have greater control over holding temperatures and wild swings. That's why I opted for a heavy walled pellet in the first place. Those cheaper thin wall units aren't going to last as long and are not very efficient. I utilize about a pound per hour of pellets at about 250-275*. Ask each manufacture what their pellet consumption rate is, I think you will find a pound per hour is a pretty good benchmark.

      Both Yoder, Rec Tec, Pitts & Spitts and others have grilling capabilities. What most of them do is give you direct access to the burn pot for grilling. It works but it's really not your best grilling option. Having a cooker specifically designed to grill is a much better bet. Having a magical all in one machine is something that's difficult to achieve.

      I'd also give the MAK a good hard look. I think their grilling technique is probably better than most and being a solid stainless design is a real plus. Good luck, I hope you find the pit that is right for you !!!!

      Comment


        #6
        Camp Chef Woodwind seems like it fits your needs (other than size, I'm not sure about that) best, with the gas sear station. Pellet smoker, gas sear burner.

        Comment


          #7
          Can only speak to Rec Tec. They are NOT cheaply made. Maybe not as thick as the Yoder, but definitely not cheaply made.

          Comment


          • treesmacker
            treesmacker commented
            Editing a comment
            Agreed - the Rec Tec I own seems to be robust (Trailblazer); though it is my first and only pellet grill, I'm happy with it.

          #8
          If the yoder consumes a few more pellets, that means it is making more smoke!

          Comment


            #9
            Originally posted by Rod View Post
            Can only speak to Rec Tec. They are NOT cheaply made. Maybe not as thick as the Yoder, but definitely not cheaply made.
            Sorry, I was referring more to the appearance rather than construction, they don't have the premium look that I think the Yoder and especially the P&S have. I know from reading reviews they are well made, I would not have included it if it wasn't.

            Do you have the grill grates kit, and if so how well does it sear?

            Comment


            • Rod
              Rod commented
              Editing a comment
              No worries! I did get the grill grates with it, but have never used them on it. Can't see how they would create a good sear unless I pull out the drip pan and heat deflector. Too much effort when I have a Weber Genesis with grill grates and a sear station.

            #10
            I will say I love my Yoder YS-640. I looked long and hard before pulling the trigger, however, very glad I did.

            Concerns
            1. Pellet Hog - no. At 225-250 mine burns 1 to 1 1/2 pounds an hour depending on ambient temp and, more important here in Western Kansas, wind speed. Has a hopper that holds greater than 20 lbs so long Cook’s aren’t a problem. I follow Yoder’s recommendations regarding warming pit prior to long cooks. Works great.

            2. Rust. Not a problem.

            3. Wheels. I got the comp cart because my buddy has one without them and he has a hard time moving it. It was more expensive, however, it has been worth it.

            4. Direct grilling. I thought it was voodoo or a gimmick and I have a nice gasser and a couple Weber Kettle Grills. However, figured he grill grates worth a try and I got the two piece diffuser (makes pot clean up easy). Then one day I decided to use the grill grates and direct sear some ribeyes. Wow. Delicious. It really works great. Best with 4 or less good sized steaks, however, I’ve rotated up to 8 steaks and worked fine (my friend does this routinely).

            5. I’ll try to measure without side shelf and let you know.

            Bonus:

            The controller is awesome. Works very well and keeps tight control -usually well within 5 degrees (unless super windy - not unusual to have 20-30 mph winds). Even at 20-25 mph winds it’s awesome. I’m very impressed compared to my GMG Jim Bowie.

            Bottom line one I have no regrets about this purchase. It works as advertised and I have no concerns in recommending his product. Good luck on your search.

            Comment


              #11
              what about the Mak2star ?

              Comment


                #12
                Originally posted by Jon Liebers View Post
                what about the Mak2star ?
                The Mak 2 star looks real nice and I have read nothing but positive things about it. I certainly haven't ruled it out completely, but it's also a big price jump vs. the YS640. Most of what I've read about the YS is also positive, so tough to justify going much higher than that on price.

                Comment


                  #13
                  I’m a Yoder 640 owner and love it. I have never found it to be a pellet hog. Once heated up the thick construction keeps the heat even and I believe reduces the usage of pellets because it is not constantly making us for loss from the metal.
                  The side shelf can just be lifted up and freed for storing in the smoker.
                  I have the regular wheels setup and have no problems moving it around our decks, nor down a flagstone and crushed path down to the lower meadow.
                  I live by the ocean with salt water on three sides of our property and rust has not been a problem. My Yoder lives outdoors year round. They even included some touch up paint which I haven’t needed to use.

                  Forgot to add that the grill grates work great for searing over the firebox. There is a button on the controller for adding more pellets when you want, and I use it to increase the fire when going to sear.
                  Last edited by Donw; June 21, 2018, 12:34 PM.

                  Comment


                    #14
                    Well, I pulled the trigger on the YS640, ordered online from ATBBQ. I am hoping it will be here by the 4th (if not I do have other methods of heating meat).

                    Ordered the YS640 with the access door heat diffuser (the one annoyance is they don't either make this standard or an optional upgrade ... you end up having to purchase in addition to which means I will have two diffuser plates) and grill grates, a tel tru door thermometer, and few other eggcessories. Shipping to FL came out to ~$200, I was worried it would be more than that (the comp cart model would have been $400 to ship, bringing the total cost diff of comp cart vs. non comp cart model to $600 shipped).

                    I will post here w/ pics and impressions once I get a couple of cooks under my belt.

                    Thank you all for the helpful input.
                    Last edited by Walt Dockery; June 21, 2018, 02:53 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Nate
                      Nate commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Congrats on your new cooker... I am sure you will love it! Can't wait to see the pics and hear your thoughts.

                    • Potkettleblack
                      Potkettleblack commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Congrats on the buy. Many happy smokes.

                    • Sweaty Paul
                      Sweaty Paul commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Congratulations! Think you’ll love it.

                    #15
                    Arrived yesterday (pretty fast shipping - ordered last Thurs the 21, shipped the 22, arrived at my house in FL the 28). I got it assembled and did the initial burn in, but haven't cooked anything on it yet.

                    During the initial burn in, I was a little surprised by the swings in temp. I left the set temp at 350 and kept the lid closed, it heated fairly quickly and over shot to ~390, cooled to ~280, slowly rised again. I don't think at any point did it stay at 350 long. I understand it's a real fire, but so are the charcoal fires in the egg and the kettle and I seem to have much more stable temps. A few things I did may have contributed, in particular I didn't have the hopper very full (was using hickory and wanted to be able to switch to cherry/pecan later this weekend so didn't fill it up much) so maybe it wasn't feeding consistently. Maybe having a hunk of meat on there will help even it out too. Writeup on the yoder forum says it could take 45 mins to stabilize so this might not be abnormal, IIRC it was around 350 by the end of the hour.

                    I will try to do some burgers and stuff this weekend to further test it. For the 4th I plan to do a brisket, as well as some burgers/dogs/sausages.
                    Last edited by Walt Dockery; June 29, 2018, 07:46 AM.

                    Comment

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