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Need some opinions on my plan - Baltimore Pit Beef

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  • andy.wpg
    Club Member
    • Aug 2016
    • 257
    • Grid EN19MV

    • PBC - at the trailer
      Masterbuilt 30" digital electric - at home
      Bakerstone Pizza Oven
      Maverick 733 RF thermometer
      Kingsford Blue Bag
      Ribs, Chicken (smoked and rotisserie), Pork Shoulder,
      Brisket. Like to make sausages. I'll try cooking ANYTHING at least once!

    Need some opinions on my plan - Baltimore Pit Beef

    Even though we are in the depths of winter - I need to taste some smoke! This weekend is supposed to be fairly mild, so, on that basis I want to do Baltimore Pit Beef sandwiches (Meathead version).

    Since I got my sous vide circulator, I want to try this method:

    Friday evening:
    -Inject the meat (3-4 pound bottom round) as per the recipe and dry brine overnight.
    Saturday:
    -apply the rub (Mrs O'Leary's Cow Crust) and into the smoker at 150F with hickory for three hours.
    -bag and into the water bath at 150F (we like it on the well-done side of medium)
    Sunday:
    -after 24 hours in the water bath, onto the gas grill to sear.
    -serve and enjoy!

    Any opinions on this plan? The 150 temp of the smoker is based on a lot of videos by Guga (Sous Vide Everything channel on YouTube).

    Thanks for any advice!
  • Potkettleblack
    Club Member
    • Jun 2016
    • 2056
    • Beautiful Downtown Berwyn
    • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330 / OK Joe Bronco Drum
      Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
      For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
      Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi (RIP Nomiku)
      Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something) - it changes

    #2
    150F on the smoker is not a good idea. Right in the bacterial danger zone. for a long period of time. If you want to smoke at that temp, you will want to fully pasteurize the beef first, like 6 hours at 135.

    Try 225F for an hour. You're just trying to build a bit of browning.

    Sous vide at 155 for 8 hours.

    Shock in ice water.

    Sear on Warp 10.

    Slice.

    Profit.

    Guga & Ninja are prolific videomakers. They're also not the most well informed cooks. I mean, they tested the best way to do garlic on a steak in SV.

    Comment


    • tRidiot
      tRidiot commented
      Editing a comment
      I'm not sure what the problem with the garlic on the steak video was? Perhaps you could clarify what you meant?
  • Danjohnston949
    In Memoriam
    • Dec 2014
    • 4398
    • 1410 9th. St. N, Fargo ND

    #3
    andy.wpg, Where th Heck Have You Been Buddy❓ I Was Kind of Looking Forward to Seeing You and Your Buddy when You Were On Your Way to Brainard to Officiate the Sports Car Races❓ Next Summer For Sure❓

    I Am Not Sure I Can Be Much Help to You on Your Sou Vee/Smoke Question❗️ I Have Only Souix Veee Douixed one Chuck Roast Todate and I Think I Screwed That Up‼️ Basically I Did What You Propose,
    Dry Brined for 24 Hrs in a Bag in Fridge, Dry Rubbed +- 6 Hrs Ahead of the SVD❗️ I Don't Recall the Temp and Times❗️ I Finished it by Searing in the Weber and a Vortex❗️ I'll Try to Find My Previous Post and Pics and Put Them Up for You❗️ I do Recall Thinking the Roast While Tender was Over Cooked and Tasteless❓
    IMHOP, From a Backyard Cremator in Fargo ND, Dan

    Comment

    • andy.wpg
      Club Member
      • Aug 2016
      • 257
      • Grid EN19MV

      • PBC - at the trailer
        Masterbuilt 30" digital electric - at home
        Bakerstone Pizza Oven
        Maverick 733 RF thermometer
        Kingsford Blue Bag
        Ribs, Chicken (smoked and rotisserie), Pork Shoulder,
        Brisket. Like to make sausages. I'll try cooking ANYTHING at least once!

      #4
      Originally posted by Danjohnston949 View Post
      andy.wpg, Where th Heck Have You Been Buddy❓ I Was Kind of Looking Forward to Seeing You and Your Buddy when You Were On Your Way to Brainard to Officiate the Sports Car Races❓ Next Summer For Sure❓

      We went a different route last year - it appears to be somewhat quicker.

      As to this year, we'll talk closer to the date. Its still seven months away!

      I will be very interested to see what you did.

      Andy

      Comment

      • andy.wpg
        Club Member
        • Aug 2016
        • 257
        • Grid EN19MV

        • PBC - at the trailer
          Masterbuilt 30" digital electric - at home
          Bakerstone Pizza Oven
          Maverick 733 RF thermometer
          Kingsford Blue Bag
          Ribs, Chicken (smoked and rotisserie), Pork Shoulder,
          Brisket. Like to make sausages. I'll try cooking ANYTHING at least once!

        #5
        Originally posted by Potkettleblack View Post
        150F on the smoker is not a good idea. Right in the bacterial danger zone. for a long period of time. If you want to smoke at that temp, you will want to fully pasteurize the beef first, like 6 hours at 135.

        Try 225F for an hour. You're just trying to build a bit of browning.

        Sous vide at 155 for 8 hours.

        Shock in ice water.
        .

        I wondered about 150 myself, but knew the experts around here would correct ne. Thanks!

        Would there be any benefit in going longer than eight hours?

        Second question: Could you explain the shock in ice water? What is the purpose of this?

        Comment


        • Danjohnston949
          Danjohnston949 commented
          Editing a comment
          That's One Of The Steps I Forgot Andy❓ I have Noted on Others Posts
          That They Don't Brine or Season Before SVD❓ Dan

        • Potkettleblack
          Potkettleblack commented
          Editing a comment
          So, mantra time. Time is tenderness, temp is doneness.

          Chuck isn’t short rib, but I find this a useful link on how to think about it. https://www.chefsteps.com/activities...-ribs-your-way

          Chuck has less collagen, and MH’s pit beef recipe has you cook it more like steak than like a braise, which is why I’d go shorter, rather than longer.
      • Troutman
        Club Member
        • Aug 2017
        • 8121
        • 1521

        • OUTDOOR COOKERS

          BBQ ACCESSORIES

          WOOD & PELLET PREFERENCES

          SOUS VIDE

          INDOOR COOKWARE


        #6
        I'm sure Max will chime in but what he means is once the bath is done you want to shock it in a pan if ice water to stop the cooking process and cool the meat. That way you don't over cook it when you do the final sear.

        Comment

        • Potkettleblack
          Club Member
          • Jun 2016
          • 2056
          • Beautiful Downtown Berwyn
          • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330 / OK Joe Bronco Drum
            Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
            For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
            Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi (RIP Nomiku)
            Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something) - it changes

          #7
          andy.wpg http://sousvideresources.com/2016/07/21/safety-should-not-be-shocking/
          The best way to achieve 70F right out of the bath is to plunge your product in at least twice its volume of cold water, preferably with ice.

          In AR parlance, “The Big Chill.” (I hate that name).
          https://amazingribs.com/more-techniq...vide-que-steak

          “In order to properly, and safely, execute the method, food is prepared in a sous vide bath then quickly immersed in a 50/50 mix of water and ice in order to rapidly reduce the core temperature of the food to a safe range of 34-38°F. Once food has remained in the ice bath for at least 30 minutes, it can be refrigerated or frozen.“

          if the plan plan is to go from the water to the grill directly, 10 minutes in ice water of sufficient volume will be adequate. In that instance, you’re doing it for aesthetics, not food safety. If you’re refrigerating for later use, then shock it all the way down below 70 before putting it in the fridge.




          Troutman I would greatly prefer it if you did not use my real name.

          Comment


          • Troutman
            Troutman commented
            Editing a comment
            Oh sorry guy, hate to rain on your parade or name .....

          • Potkettleblack
            Potkettleblack commented
            Editing a comment
            Just one of my quirks.
        • Baltassar
          Club Member
          • Apr 2016
          • 129
          • Northern California

          #8
          My approach to things like this is sous vide > chill > smoke > sear rather than smoke > sous vide > chill > sear.

          Not sure what difference it makes to the outcome, but it seems simpler to me. I am using a gas grill, however, so going from smoke to sear is easy.

          Comment


          • tRidiot
            tRidiot commented
            Editing a comment
            I agree, I think smoking prior to SV is great. I prefer this to smoking afterwards, where the smoke flavor doesn't seem to get into it as well, even if you've cooled it down first.

          • Baltassar
            Baltassar commented
            Editing a comment
            I suppose because the uncooked meat is more receptive/porous/stickier? Based on no experience, I would have suspected the extractive nature of the sous vide process would have worked against the smoke. But maybe not.

          • Potkettleblack
            Potkettleblack commented
            Editing a comment
            Smoke flavor particles are smaller than salt. So they penetrate. They do so better on cold and wet things, and they do not do so on meat cooked above a certain temp. As folks are fond of traditional brisket texture, they cook at 155, which is too hot for much smoke adherence, even with shock and chill.
        • Potkettleblack
          Club Member
          • Jun 2016
          • 2056
          • Beautiful Downtown Berwyn
          • Grill: Grilla Original / Weber Genesis EP-330 / OK Joe Bronco Drum
            Thermometers: Thermapen / iGrill 2 / Fireboard
            For Smoke: Chunks / Pellet Tube / Mo Pouch
            Sous Vide: Joule / Nomiku WiFi (RIP Nomiku)
            Disqus: Le Chef - (something something something) - it changes

          #9
          tRidiot http://sousvideresources.com/2016/07...-in-sous-vide/

          Some bacterial species, including C. botulinum, produce spores in an unfavorable growth environment to preserve the organism’s viability and permit survival in a dormant state until the spores are exposed to favorable conditions, at which time they “hatch” and create the toxin. This is why you don’t use fresh garlic in sous vide low temperature (less than 140F) processing.

          It’s also not the ONLY reason.

          ...

          Vegetables typically require higher temps, 183F+ to denature, so keep this in mind. They will not cook in the bag at lesser temps.

          its a surface treatment that can cause botulism and doesn’t actually cook, can go wonky in flavor.

          SVE are perhaps the least foodsafe people on the internet and frequently the least informed.

          Comment


          • andy.wpg
            andy.wpg commented
            Editing a comment
            I guess I'll be viewing them with a grain of salt FNO. They are fun to watch, though.

          • tRidiot
            tRidiot commented
            Editing a comment
            I wasn't aware of the problems with the garlic in the sous vide. Glad to know about it. I've switched to using garlic powder pretty exclusively before this, but will definitely keep it in mind in the future. Thanks!

          • Potkettleblack
            Potkettleblack commented
            Editing a comment
            So, two fundamental rules here.
            1- surface treatments are fine, so long as you aren't lying to yourself about flavor penetration.
            2- vegetables and herbs don't break down at steak temperatures.
        • Danjohnston949
          In Memoriam
          • Dec 2014
          • 4398
          • 1410 9th. St. N, Fargo ND

          #10
          andy.wpg , I Finally Found The Pics of My One and Only Souix Veeee Doooo Attempt So Far❓ Might Be My
          Last❓❓ I Haven't Found My Post Yet But Will‼️ From a Backyard Cremator in Fargo ND, Dan

          Click image for larger version

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          2021 Meat-Up In Memphis Canceled - Rescheduled for March 2022

          This summer's 2021 Meat-Up in Memphis IS OFFICIALLY RESCHEDULED FOR March 18-20, 2022. More details and re-booking info here!
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