Carbon Steel Knives

[Richard Chrz]

So, exactly how much loving do they need, and is it like instantly, before you even eat your meal, you better, clean, oil, polish and protect, or pay big consequences. I may or may not be in the market to spend up to about 100 dollars or so on a 8 inch chef knife. I am pretty quick to take care of my even 9 dollars 10 inch mercer that i just got, but, I am also prone to eating my meal, then cleaning everything, unless I need the knife to cut something else right away. I want quality, but, I don't want it to be my life's work to baby it. Not entirely familiar to this world, I often think of quality as needing less of my attention. But, does not seem to be the case in this world. I am always willing to make a mistake on a cook, but, regretting a purchase on equipment and tools would drive me insane. One of a few I am considering. https://www.amazon.com/Togiharu-Virg...ustomerReviews

[Spinaker]

I am not sure how much care they require, but my guess would be that flash rust can be an issue.

Just curious, why are you looking for carbon steel knives and not stainless?

[Richard Chrz]

I don't have a good answer, other then a few bits of reading talking about sharpness and holding it longer has me intrigued. but, so does a 20 - 50 dollar Mercer to be honest. I am not sure I would even understand a great knife in my hand.

[FireMan]

That was my question also, why. Why put yourself through that worry & concern & effort.

[Richard Chrz]

FireMan that is a good question, that one I can answer though. I tend to do better in life when I make myself maintain effort in being engaged in processes and learning. So a knife from a financial standpoint (investment wise) like a good cast iron or... typically make me not just float through. Honestly, one of the reasons I have engaged in cooking in these types of ways like grilling. I could easily just order pizza, and eat hot dogs and nachos every night.

[MBMorgan]

I would suggest that you just stick with a high-carbon stainless blade. It will still require a bit of TLC (but not urgently) and will stay sharp for a long time if you use a steel religiously and you don't do silly things like cutting on a hard surface and/or using the sharp edge of the blade to scrape food sideways on the cutting board.

My 40 year old Wusthof Classic knives still look like new, are sharp as razors, and they get sharpened only about once every 12-18 months.

[Loren]

I use a Fiddleback Forge in the kitchen; it is O1 (carbon steel). I forced a patina on it way back when, and that can definitely help slow corrosion. I will rinse it when I'm done cutting and wash it later - if it gets corrosion in that time a few wipes with a green scrubbie and soap will remove corrosion.


That said, it can and will get minor rust if you leave it covered in whatever for too long. Or unoiled. Or in the sheath (leather and storing carbon steel do not work well). Or if you cut onions, apples, lemons, etc.

Edit: check out chefknivestogo.com for some good info (and knives). They have a wide gamut of prices. I can attest that the Kanehide TK knives are good, especially for the relative low price.

[Richard Chrz]

Thank you for the link, I will spend some time on there. I do not have a leather sheath, But I do have a knife roll, and would like to confidently put a plastic or some sort of blade protector on it and put it in the roll. I am guessing the leather warning is from the oil in the leather.

[Mr. Bones]

Reckon leather is porous, an absorbs all ambient humidity, then slowly releases it in direct contact with yer blade...speakin as a nearly lifelong KaBar owner/ Operator...
Richard Chrz Conceivably possible a New leather sheath could outgas, etc. some stuff from th tannin process that might muck with yer blade, but not bloody likely if it goes into yer sheath clean, dry, an lightly oiled....
There's my ¢2, fer what it's worth....

[RonB]

Carbon steel does rust, and some can rust quickly. However, I have found that simply rinsing and wiping dry will work until I am done eating. I cut acidic things like tomatoes and lemons with mine without problems. I also don't oil mine after use either, but I do make sure they are bone dry before I put them away.

Carbon knives will develop a patina over time, and that will add a bit of rust resistance.

[Attjack]

I gotta claim ignorance but I did see this knife is 40% youoff if clip the coupon. That works out to about $18. No idea how good it is or is not.

https://www.amazon.com/Deik-Damascus...&creative=9325




Chefs Knife Kitchen Knife, VG-10 Core with 67 Layers Damascus Steel, Ergonomic Pakka Handle, Santoku Style Multipurpose Cooking Knife Balanced,With Gift Box

[Attjack]

My gut says you should go with a Wusthof.

[Troutman]

There are a plethora of knives on the market that look like the one above, claim to be Damascus folded steel but in fact are nothing but etched stainless to look like folded. Buyer beware.

[Mr. Bones]

I have a few Mercers, several Wüsthof knives, never have regretted neither ones...

I also have quite a collection of carbon steel Old Hickory, an Chicago Cutlery knives...none are rusty, an I agree with lettin em develop a 'patina', summat like seasonin a Cast Iron pan.
As pointed out by Brother Troutman, beware alla th carpola 'Damascus' that permeates th market...

Any questions, give us all a holler...

A junk knife is a junk knife, at ANY pricepoint, my friend...

[JimLinebarger]

I don't let any of my knives sit after use. I usually clean and put them away so my carbon steel knives never sit more than a few minutes. I do this partly because before and shortly after I married my wife, her middle name was "Murphy". I remember going into the kitchen when she was chopping veggies. Sometimes she would say something while flipping a 10" chef's knife around. A few times quite near my face. But I also sharpen all of the knives in the house to shaving or near shaving quality. Especially my knives. Every time I sharpen her knives, I let her know that they are now sharpened, with the underlying meaning "No Murphy". I clean my knives so my wife doesn't handle them.

[Old Glory]

This guy gets great reviews. MAC Japanese Style Chef Knife:

https://www.amazon.com/Mac-Knife-Professional-Hollow-8-Inch/dp/B000N5H2XU/ref=as_li_ss_tl?creativeASIN=B000N5H2XU&imprToken=CoA8JlKoacyPboSrhN8QVg&slotNum=0&ie=UTF8&linkCode=w61&tag=fwgearbestknives-20&linkId=798ee1c4183d09f89fd87cbda46c857a

https://www.foodandwine.com/lifestyle/kitchen/best-chefs-knife

a "terrific all-rounder," and I agree. Made in Japan, it has a hard, super-sharp blade and a simple wooden handle that’s extremely comfortable and feels secure in the hand. It’s razor sharp for a reason—MAC’s founder modeled the company’s knives on razors. The blade is beveled to a very thin, very acute angle, which makes it extraordinarily sharp. The the high carbon stainless steel makes it quite hard, but also has a dose of molybdenum, which lessens brittleness and makes the metal more flexible, less likely to chip. It’s light and feels balanced, with a shape that’s natural and easy to control. It can chiffonade basil cleanly, without bruising the leaves at all. It effortlessly bites through tomato skin, and cuts a neat onion dice with ease. It supremes an orange quickly and precisely. The combination of the razor-like blade and the familiar, comfortable blade shape and handle were, for me, what made it the very best choice overall. It is on the light side, but not the lightest of the light: It is less well suited to cutting up a whole chicken or butternut squash than the German knives, but it was the best Japanese knife for those tasks, with just enough heft to get the job done. If I could only have one knife, I would definitely choose this one.

[ComfortablyNumb]

I only buy old used carbon steel knives at thrift stores or on eBay. I use an Edge Pro to make them razor sharp. When I use any knife I rinse, wipe, and dry immediately, even if I intend to use it again in a few minutes. This habit takes mere secondsand saves me from the 'oops, I forgot to clean the knife' despair. Unfortunately Mrs. Numb does not share the same habit, but a little Bar Keepers Friend will clean them back up.

[Richard Chrz]

I may look for a few used and if alright, could I send a link to you. If they are already damaged, I probably can not do much worse to them in learning to bring a knife back, or am I kidding myself? When you say thin them down, that sounds beyond my current, but, maybe with the right tools,...

[Richard Chrz]

Or do you sell any of your restores?

[ComfortablyNumb]

Richard Chrz I haven't yet. Frankly I have too many irons in the fire as it is. I was introduced to the system I use by a fellow at the farmers market. He set up a booth and sharpened knives. Hog butchering can be taxing on knives, so I find starting with several gets me through without have to stop and dress them. It's like having a bullpen of relief pitchers.

[mountainsmoker]

Don't worry about modern carbon, stainless steel knives. They are made of a blend of a mix of metals that prevent staining. Carbon and Stainless being the two main metals. Knifes can range from a hardness of K55-K64. I normally clean mine after using but an hour or two doesn't hurt them. The only knife I had that stained was a carbon steel Wustof that I bought in France. It held an edge like nothing else.

[Mosca]

Lots of good advice from everyone. Every thing I would have written, has been written.

There are advantages to both carbon and high carbon stainless. I went with high carbon stainless. Cromova is what Global calls it. But I still clean them immediately. It’s not hard once you get in the habit. Chop chop chop, wipe, dry, hang on magnet strip.

That MAC knife is really nice. I would be happy with it.

You wrote that you would not understand a great knife in your hand. I am here to tell you that you are wrong. The better the knife, the easier it is for ANYONE to use. As much as I liked my inexpensive Victorinoxes, once I got a Global I never used them ever again. There was no point to it. (Hehe.)

First we get the cheapest knife we can. Then we get the best knife that we can get from the big box store. And finally we get the one we should have bought in the first place. For most of us the sweet spot is going to be around $100. That just seems to hit a nice value equation for the home cook.

There’s something to to be said for CN’s buying used carbon steel knives second hand. If you’re into it, it sounds like fun. Myself, I wouldn’t know what to look for. But also, I’ve already committed. I have a knife (actually three) that I love. Every now and then I get MKS, but that’s an easy fight to win.

[Polarbear777]

Not hard to care for, but beware anyone else ever using it. They won’t take care of it and it will rust.

[Beefchop]

A light coat of mineral oil. That's pretty much it - clean it, dry it, and oil it. I love carbon steel - doesn't hold the edge as well but can be re-sharpened pretty easily with a wet stone and some technique. And by "edge" I simply mean it dulls faster than other steels, but then again it's pretty easy to make razor sharp again. My game dressing knives are carbon steel.

[treesmacker]

Well, this is the one I want...

https://www.amazon.com/Ferrum-FEEC0800-BRK-Estate-Chefs-Knife/dp/B07D19HYSK

I have their paring knife and really like it. It is high carbon stainless steel.
Best of luck with this.
BTW, for less expensive knives knives, I'm super impressed with the Victorinix Fibrox pro series... https://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Fi...0863&s=gateway

[ComfortablyNumb]

This will help you understand knife angles and why they need thinning.



As you can see there are two edges, the primary and the secondary. The thinner the angle, the sharper the blade, at a cost of weakness. The thicker the angle, less sharpness, however more durable. The best marriage of the two for kitchen knives is around 20 degrees, so the primary edge is set at that angle. Notice the distance between the shoulders of the primary, it is thin. Now picture in your minds eye that angle further up the blade, say where the arrowhead is. The shoulders of the primary will be much thicker even though you are still at 20 degrees on the primary. This creates drag and the knife won't slice as well. Taking metal off the secondary edge so it is now at the same thickness it was when first honed is needed. This process is called 'thinning'. After you thin, you then make a new primary edge and the knife is as good as new.

So why do people get rid of their knives? Because they don't understand the concept and the knife isn't performing like it did new. Most home chefs use a pull through or electric sharpener, and these don't thin the knife. So they get a new one. The old one sits in a drawer until they declutter and donate it to a thrift store. That's where I step in. Rather than purchase expensive knives, that will eventually need sharpening, I purchased an expensive sharpening system. I turn a five or ten dollar knife into one that is as sharp as the hundred dollar knife. And I keep it that sharp, turning a chef knife into a paring knife until there isn't any more metal to grind away.

Bottom line is, whatever knife you get, treat it kindly, don't try to cut what it wasn't meant to cut, don't leave it in the sink with every other soiled utensil. Keep it clean and dry. Store it properly. Learn to sharpen or have it professionally done. By taking good care of it, it will provide you years of loyal service.

[Santamarina]

Thanks for your insight. I’ve got a Wusthof 8” chefs knife that I’ve had for almost 18 years. I do not properly maintain the edge, and it shows. Reading this thread I think the best plan is to not replace this knife, but get it properly sharpened and then perform proper maintenance so it continues to perform at a high level well into the future.

[Donw]

Thrift stores are a great place to look for knives, and you can strike it big sometimes. I’m always amazed when I find top shelf knives sitting in the bins priced at a dollar or two, and all they need is a quick sharpening to bring back to life.