Welcome!


This is a membership forum. As a guest, you can click around a bit. View 5 pages for free. If you would like to participate, please join.

[ Pitmaster Club Information | Join Now | Login | Contact Us ]

There are 4 page views remaining.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Stall

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Mr. Bones
    commented on 's reply
    Havedta agree th meat could also be a Big factour; Poste up on here, I once cooked twoo racks of BBRs, they was within.o1 oz of each other, one rack took an hour longer than t'other...

  • IowaGirl
    commented on 's reply
    A psychrometer (humidity measuring device) for a smoker is pretty straightforward. You need 2 temp sensors. One is the "dry bulb" => your usual air temp probe. The other, the "wet bulb", has a wetted fabric sock on the tip. The sock has to be wet at all times so this probe will be cooled by evaporation. The temp difference between the two can be converted into the relative humidity. More: https://www.canr.msu.edu/smprv/uploa..._Humidity1.pdf

  • DogFaced PonySoldier
    replied
    Originally posted by Ken Haskin View Post
    After thinking about this I propose an explanation might be that the humidity in my pit was higher therefore there was less surface evaporation and hence less cooling of the meat. Analogous to the comfort level of perspiring on a hot day in a dry climate versus a humid climate.

    I think this is a key point... in hot dry climate, you sweat, it evaporates and you lose heat through the evaporative cooling. Which is the exact intent of the sweating - to decrease your body temp.

    In smoking, increasing humidity in the cooking environment (via addition of a water pan) could decrease how much sweat evaporates, thus retaining more heat in the large hunk of meat - which is the idea, to cook the meat. But... is your water pan really affecting the measurable humidity inside the cooker all that much? I am not so sure...

    Now, the question is, how do we measure the humidity in a large volume cooker, and how much of the water evaporates from the water pan to raise the humidity. I mean, at this point you have to get into psychrometric data and the circulation of air, how often the air passing through the cooker is changed out and how much humidity it carries with it, weighing your water pan to determine lost weight (and volume) of water into the air, etc.

    Of course, you could physically measure the humidity inside the relative cookers, but this isn't as easy as it sounds. The high temp alone rules out most simple home devices and using an industrial device would be a lot more difficult to come by 2 of them.

    The easiest thing to do by far is to repeat the experiment with as identical cooks side by side as you can - and swap the water pan. I'm really interested to know, myself.

    Leave a comment:


  • Caffeine88
    commented on 's reply
    ....if we're going to the same point. But we don't want to go to the same point - we want to stop dry meat. Thus moist air would stop taking heat out faster than dry air - ergo, quicker end to the stall with either a wrap or a pan(but prob much less impact).

    I stand corrected. Thanks!
    And - more testing!

  • Caffeine88
    commented on 's reply
    IowaGirl - I'm following your reasoning.
    If minimal evaporation, then minimal energy lost to phase change, and thus minimal stall. Wrapping tightly clearly does this.

    The water pan would raise humidity in the cooker, which would raise the equilibrium point where water from the surface quits evaporating. This means less moisture loss from the meat in the cooking process. I guess I was thinking of the stall in terms of total moisture loss, which dry air would do faster

  • IowaGirl
    commented on 's reply
    Higher humidity at the surface of the meat => less evaporation loss => less heat loss from the meat => less likely to stall.

    Wrapping meat with paper or foil reduces or eliminates the stall by raising humidity and reducing overall heat loss at the meat surface. Water in a pan might have some effect too, but probably isn't as efficient as wrapping.

    All that said, a person can't draw valid conclusions from just one test. The experiment needs to be repeated to prove the point.

  • HawkerXP
    replied
    Welcome to the Pit!

    Leave a comment:


  • rickgregory
    replied
    I mean, I think you have to know/verify a few piece of information:

    1) Were both smokers actually at 230F? Is this verified by a reliable thermometer in each?
    2) Were both rigs close to the same (same size, same setup, same mods (or no mods), etc? Any apparent differences .e.g one had a leak, the other didnt?
    3) Were the comparable meats the same quality (i.e. choice) and look pretty much the same?

    All of these have to be controlled for, otherwise we can't dismiss the possibility of one or more being a factor.

    Then there's the question of the stall - how was the stall measure and timed? On the brisket, the pork butt? Both?

    If everything really is the same or very close to same, then there's really only two explanations:

    a) by happenstance the pieces of meat in one pit both had something that let them get through the stall in an hour vs 3 hours
    b) the use of a water pan.

    (a) seems unlikely if the stall was measured for each of the 4 hunks of meat. It's not impossible but feels relatively improbable.

    The easiest way of testing this is to reverse the use of the water pan and make no other changes. If that doesn't;t make a difference (the one hour pit still powers its meat through the stall much faster than the other pit) then you have to look at the factors above and verify them. For example, if you're just trusting the rec teq setting to be accurate you can't actually know if the pit temp was 230F, you just know that each controller was set to 230F.

    Leave a comment:


  • willxfmr
    replied
    Welcome from Wisconsin. Glad you could join us!
    I'm no scientist, but I would think the cooker with the water pan would have a higher humidity level that would slow evaporation from the meat. To my mind this is like comparing heat in Miami to heat in Phoenix.

    Leave a comment:


  • Soonerpop
    replied
    Welcome to the Pit from north Texas. Do that thing where you reverse who gets the water pan and report the results. I agree with those who said it’s probably something else. Have fun with it.

    Leave a comment:


  • FireMan
    replied
    Yup, I vote for the theory that the particular beefusses went to different schools. Welcome, eat good & have fun!

    Leave a comment:


  • Caffeine88
    replied
    Welcome from Georgia!

    I'm leaning toward something other than the water pan. If I understand correctly, the stall happens when evaporation form the surface matches the heat transfer into the air via convective cooling and the phase change of moisture to vapor. Dry air at the same temp as moist air will accept more/faster evaporation from the surface - meaning the smoker without the humidity-adding water pan should reach equilibrium sooner and power through the stall faster.

    With that said, I'm with tbob4 - try it again with the pans reversed and let us know! The worst that happens is you have to eat more brisket... 😁😁

    Leave a comment:


  • Donw
    replied
    Welcome from Maryland

    Leave a comment:


  • Jfrosty27
    replied
    I have Recteq RT-700. If that’s the dark side, well I want to be there. As for yor experiment, I have no idea. 🤷‍♂️

    Leave a comment:


  • IFindZeroBadCooks
    replied
    Click image for larger version

Name:	B457AC3B-9045-41A4-AADB-D047164F372B.gif
Views:	97
Size:	667.2 KB
ID:	1112008

    Leave a comment:

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.
Working...
X
false
0
Guest
500
["pitmaster-my-membership","login","join-pitmaster","lostpw","reset-password","special-offers","help","nojs","meat-ups","gifts","authaau-alpha","ebooklogin-start","alpha","start"]
false
false
{"count":0,"link":"/forum/announcements/","debug":""}
Yes
Rubs Promo

Spotlight

These are not ads or paid placements. These are some of our favorite tools and toys.

These are products we have tested, won our top awards, and are highly recommend. Click here to read how we test, about our medals, and what they mean.

Use Our Links To Help Keep Us Alive

A big part of this site is our unbiased equipment and product reviews. We love playing with toys and we have no problem calling them the way we see them. Some companies pay a finder’s fee if a reader clicks a link on AmazingRibs.com and buys a product. It has zero impact on our reviews, zero impact on the price you pay, and the sites never tell us what you bought, but it has a major impact on our ability to keep this site alive! So before you buy, please click our links. Here’s a link that takes you to a page on Amazon that has some of our favorite tools and toys: https://tinyurl.com/amazingribs


The Pit Barrel Cooker May Be Too Easy


The PBC has a rabid cult following for good reason. It is absolutely positively without a doubt the best bargain on a smoker in the world. Period. This baby will cook circles around the cheap offset sideways barrel smokers because temperature control is so much easier.

Click here to read our detailed review and the raves from people who own them


Blackstone Rangetop Combo: Griddle And Deep Fryer In One


The flat top does the burgers and the fryer does the fries. Use the griddle for bacon, eggs, grilled cheese, and so much more. And why deep fry indoors when you can avoid the smell and mess by doing it outside!

Click here to read our detailed review and to order


Finally, A Great Portable Pellet Smoker


Green Mountain’s portable Davy Crockett Pellet Smoker is one mean tailgating and picnic machine. But it’s also gaining popularity with people who want to add a small, set it and forget it pellet smoker to their backyard arsenal. And with their WiFi capabilities you can control and monitor Davy Crocket from your smart phone or laptop.

Click here to read our detailed review and to order


Groundbreaking Hybrid Thermometer!

Thermapen One Instant Read Thermometer

The FireBoard Spark is a hybrid combining instant-read capability, a cabled temperature probe, Bluetooth and Wi-Fi connectivity. We gave Spark a Platinum Medal for pushing the envelope of product capability while maintaining high standards of design and workmanship.

Click here to read our comprehensive Platinum Medal review

 

Comprehensive Temperature Magnet With 80+ Important Temps

Amazingribs.com temperature magnet
Winner of the National BBQ Association’s product of the year award. This 8.5″ x 11″ magnet contains more that 80 benchmark temperatures for meats (both USDA recommended temps as well as the temps chefs recommend), fats and oils, sugars, sous vide, eggs, collagens, wood combustion, breads, and more. Although it is not certified as all-weather, we have tested it outdoors in Chicago weather and it has not delaminated in three years, but there is minor fading.

Click here to order.


Grilla Pellet Smoker proves good things come in small packages

We always liked Grilla. The small 31.5″ x 29.5″ footprint makes it ideal for use where BBQ space is limited, as on a condo patio.
Click here for our review on this unique smoker


Is This Superb Charcoal Grill A Kamado Killer?


The PK-360, with 360 square inches of cooking space, this rust free, cast aluminum charcoal grill is durable and easy to use. Four-way venting means it’s easy to set up for two zone cooking with more control than single vent Kamado grills. It is beautifully designed, completely portable, and much easier to set up for 2-zone cooking than any round kamado.

Click here to read our detailed review of the PK 360

Click here to order directly and get an exclusive AmazingRibs.com deal